I’ve installed the latest 11.4 (RC2) and have the same issue with it that I’ve had with 11.3: Black screen after the first boot. The solution is to include the nomodeset parameter in the boot menu. If I include this option in YAST before the build, no black screen. If I don’t include it initially, I must edit menu.lst or I will get a black screen on every boot. I have an Nvidia display card, although I have also had the same issue with machines using ATI video.
This appears to be a common theme that I seen mentioned in various places in these forums. I do not know what this magical parameter actually does, but it would seem that it is required more than not. If that is the case, why does the YAST installer not include it by default? Seems to me it would save a LOT of frustration from folks who are a lot less technical (and patient) then I. Does it cause problems if it is included when NOT needed? I’m assuming that the parameter does something to make up for deficiencies in the video detection software?
I’ve installed the latest 11.4 (RC2) and have the same issue with it that I’ve had with 11.3: Black screen after the first boot. The solution is to include the nomodeset parameter in the boot menu. If I include this option in YAST before the build, no black screen. If I don’t include it initially, I must edit menu.lst or I will get a black screen on every boot. I have an Nvidia display card, although I have also had the same issue with machines using ATI video.
This appears to be a common theme that I seen mentioned in various places in these forums. I do not know what this magical parameter actually does, but it would seem that it is required more than not. If that is the case, why does the YAST installer not include it by default? Seems to me it would save a LOT of frustration from folks who are a lot less technical (and patient) then I. Does it cause problems if it is included when NOT needed? I’m assuming that the parameter does something to make up for deficiencies in the video detection software?
richardrosa, lots of people do use this command in order to facilitate the installation of proprietary video drivers such as those provided by AMD and nVIDIA. However, I am guessing that less than half of everyone that installs openSUSE 11.4, must add this command to see something. For instance, I have found openSUSE 11.4 to install a default setup that even includes 3D for my nVIDIA GPU 450 card. I add the nomodeset command to install the proprietary driver, but it is purely an optional act that I perform. I am almost certain that if most people had to add this command, it would be there by default, but that is simply not the case. Further, while you see a lot of problems where this command is the fix, people simply do not come to the forum and post a message saying I got openSUSE to work without using the nomodeset command. Further, while I know I suggest this fix often, perhaps half of that time, that was not the actual problem. If this option was there by default, video setups that work fine using KMS (Kernel Mode Switching), would never get a try out with this option set in place. It is simply the nature of the beast.
Scroll to the right in that, and one will see nomodeset is ALREADY a default boot code in Failsafe.
Ergo, this has already been done.
I think the view is the automatic configuration of X is getting better and better, and reasons for needing nomodeset should be getting less and less. Plus ‘nomodeset’ tends to only be needed on the oldest or the very newest hardware (where older hardware is getting less and less) and hence with nomodeset in Fail Safe, there is no need to separate in a drop down menu.
… albeit there are exceptions - for example a recent bug introduced in 11.4 RC2 (but not in 11.4 RC1) has broken 11.4 RC2 for all Radeon hardware users, requiring nomodeset independent of hardware age … Still, Failsafe also WORKS for that hardware … *]
Also, in pretty much in ALL cases where ‘nomodeset’ works, so dues ‘Failsafe’ work.
BUT having typed the above, if one believes having nomodeset is useful as a separate option, make an openFATE submission.
In four machines with older 6xxx and 7xxx nvidia cards all 11.3/KDE4 installs ran ok without the need to use this option, either with the open-source or proprietary drivers. In one instance I included it in the standard (not failsafe) boot parameters, with the effect of making X use the nouveau driver instead of the installed nvidia driver.
So IME having nomodeset as a default parameter would not be a good idea, at least for machines in this age range.
As the other two have mentioned, it is a work around for specific video cards that give trouble with auto detection. It has to do with more advanced features of the video devices as would be needed to handle 2D, 3D, and other accelerated graphics features. Even Plasmoids can cause trouble with certain video cards. Many people, want to Install Linux and dive right in to using streaming video, gaming, etc. and when they have a compatible video they can install and go without any work a rounds. In your case, you are needing to use the NOMODEST to override video auto detect features that your video card does not know how to handle and consequently is causing the video to shut off (put into a state where it sends out no display signal) and also is causing return of information to the boot routine which it may not understand but because video has been disabled it can’t tell of. By default, this test for features in failsafe is shut off by default because it is assumed you are entering failsafe because of a problem that needs to be fixed. Thusly, in failsafe all you want is basic video. dmesg and boot logs may track down exactly why you were getting the video trouble during boots without the NOMODESET.
I guess I have the bad luck to be running the one or two video cards that don’t get detected right on install. I hope that I AM in the minority, as has been suggested. It’s not that I mind having to tweak installs to get things to work, but I know of at least one person who does. First impressions are important…
I agree whole-heartedly with richardrosa, especially in the case of liveCD. Many people use liveCD to have a peek to see if openSuse is for them, if the first impression is a non-booting system the CD becomes a coaster and they go straight back to Ubuntu or MS Win. surely it would be a trivial thing to have nomodeset as an option in he f4 drop down, with some explanation on the boot menu page? my experience so far here: Live CD 11.4 RC2
Perhaps a definition/explanation would help…?..
What is NoModeSet: The newest kernels have moved the video mode setting into the kernel. I borrowed/swiped this explanation from:Sugar Labs
It comes down to different computers having different graphics cards (or the equivalent built onto the motherboard or into a laptop). They all can draw pretty pictures. However, except for really basic (read as slow) drawing, how the software needs to talk to the card is different for every card. In the Windows world, this means you need different graphics drivers for different cards. The issue here is that some new software/drivers for Linux which do something called “kernel mode setting” for graphics cards haven’t been sufficiently tested/developed for the particular cards with which you are having problems. Specifying ‘nomodeset’ when the system boots basically tells the system to use an older set of software/drivers which does work (but may be slower or have some other issues that people would like to eliminate).
I have an ATI 4770 and ran into the boot problem mentioned by the OP when using the 11.4RC2 Live KDE CD, and had to reboot and, at the Grub Screen, put “nomodeset” on the command line entry. But, last Sunday I was generating a custom .ISO at SuseStudio and using the latest (I guess) factory repos and, using plain vanilla 11.4 stuff pulled in, the resultant .iso/CD booted straight into the desktop without the hang!
So maybe it has been addressed/fixed. It certainly has been posted enough in the forums and mailing lists.
On 03/02/2011 02:06 PM, sorenson2743 wrote:
>
> I have an ATI 4770 and ran into the boot problem mentioned by the OP
> when using the 11.4RC2 Live KDE CD, and had to reboot and, at the Grub
> Screen, put “nomodeset” on the command line entry. But, last Sunday I
> was generating a custom .ISO at SuseStudio and using the latest (I
> guess) factory repos and, using plain vanilla 11.4 stuff pulled in, the
> resultant .iso/CD booted straight into the desktop without the hang!
>
> So maybe it has been addressed/fixed. It certainly has been posted
> enough in the forums and mailing lists.
Those drivers are improving daily.
Perhaps people would be more tolerant of those driver bugs if they knew the
process of developing most of the KMS (kernel mode set) versions. Rather than
reverse engineering an existing driver by disassembling the code, they set up
the graphic memory, do a particular operation with the vendor driver, and then
look at what changed. It is a time-consuming process that will eventually yield
the proper results. Until then, some users who have different versions of the
chip will have to turn off KMS with a nomodeset and either install the
proprietary driver or run with 2D acceleration.
> Those drivers are improving daily.
>
> Perhaps people would be more tolerant of those driver bugs if they knew
> the process of developing most of the KMS (kernel mode set) versions.
> Rather than reverse engineering an existing driver by disassembling the
> code, they set up the graphic memory, do a particular operation with the
> vendor driver, and then look at what changed. It is a time-consuming
> process
That’s a programmer nightmare! It takes a special type of programming
mindset to do that and don’t get nuts in the process. My hat is off to them
in respect.
–
Cheers / Saludos,
Carlos E. R.
(from 11.2 x86_64 “Emerald” at Telcontar)