What to dislike about OpenSUSE

English Open Chat
#1

Well I’m not gonna tell you what to dislike about OpenSUSE because I’m still trying to use it so tough luck with that.

Or maybe I could say, don’t bite the hand that feeds you, or don’t insult the tool you’re using ;-).

Of course there are general things I dislike, coming from a … deb based environment.

And I do think (older forum thread) OpenSUSE is somewhat stuck in the past but that’s mostly the archaic RPM format I think.

I don’t know if it means “Red Hat Package Manager” but I also tried CentOS before installing OpenSUSE and that was NOT fun.

I don’t understand why THAT one is so popular, but anyway, that’s offtopic I guess.

Well the least fun experience of anything is when either SELinux or AppArmor frustrates your attempts to change configuration and you get weird, incomprehensible access denied errors when you were sure that you actually… oh wait, I was not going to complain.

Or when there is a log file called … but it is actually not in use, and I was not going to complain ;-).

Personally I am not a great fan of “sysconfig” → writing one configuration file in order to not have to write another.

And then Apache being set to always not only use the sysconfig, but also to regenerate it when you delete it, WHILE keeping stale copies of those files behind in /etc/apache2/ just to confuse you.

But anyway, OpenSUSE is “green” and green makes me happy.

The Apache configuration is actually complete unlike CentOS where you have to write the shtml/var/error document configuration yourself even though the files exist.

CentOS feels lean like shall-not-name but it is half-broken with barely any software available from the main repository, you have to hook onto Fedora, and then you’re still required to constantly hunt for repos.

And unlike Debian the apache configuration in OpenSUSE comes with sensible security defaults.

#2

On 2018-06-08, xen82a <xen82a@no-mx.forums.microfocus.com> wrote:
> Well I’m not gonna tell you what to dislike about OpenSUSE because I’m
> still trying to use it so tough luck with that.

In which case, your subject text is very misleading. It is however more befitting of Soapbox.

<SNIP>
> Of course there are general things I dislike, coming from a … deb
> based environment.

I don’t understand why. DEB and RPM package managers are just package managers. The choice of package management is
trivial for most users.

> And I do think (older forum thread) OpenSUSE is somewhat stuck in the
> past but that’s mostly the archaic RPM format I think.

Well no. RPM format is still the standard package management for LSB (Linux Standard Base) and therefore the preferred
method for Enterprise/Professional use.

> I don’t know if it means “Red Hat Package Manager” but I also tried
> CentOS before installing OpenSUSE and that was NOT fun.

The fact that they both use RPM has very little to do with the differences between the GNU/Linux distributions.

<SNIP>
> Personally I am not a great fan of “sysconfig” → writing one
> configuration file in order to not have to write another.

Try YaST.

<SNIP>
> But anyway, OpenSUSE is “green” and green makes me happy.

In this case, if you criticised the vile bile green I would agree with you! The openSUSE GRUB2 bootscreen is horrid but
fortunately the default desktop is much more visually appealling iMO.

> CentOS feels lean like shall-not-name but it is half-broken with barely any software available from the main
> repository, you have to hook onto Fedora, and then you’re still required to constantly hunt for repos.

I suggest therefore you complain to the CentOS forum. While CentOS and openSUSE share RPM package management, they share
very little else in common.

#3

Not sure why you respond with such hostility, I spoke in a reasonably pleasant mood.

Pointing out similarities was not intended as a way to point out differences.

In this case, if you criticised the vile bile green I would agree with you! The openSUSE GRUB2 bootscreen is horrid but
fortunately the default desktop is much more visually appealling iMO.

I’m not using a desktop so I barely have to look at it :p.

I become happy from the forums :stuck_out_tongue: (well at least the green colours).

I suggest therefore you complain to the CentOS forum. While CentOS and openSUSE share RPM package management, they share
very little else in common.

I was not fishing for recommendations, I merely wrote a colloquially reasonably happy message.

#4

First :slight_smile:
https://i.imgur.com/VzyPY71.png

Setting up apache is easy-peasy, when using YaST’s http-server module. And, talking about archaic: it also works in an ncurses-version. So on a headless server, simply use

su -c yast
#5

On 2018-06-08, xen82a <xen82a@no-mx.forums.microfocus.com> wrote:
> Not sure why you respond with such hostility, I spoke in a reasonably
> pleasant mood.

My response wasn’t hostile, just brief.

#6

And you don’t think that…

  • complaining about a miss-spelled initial capital in agreement with English capitalisation of common names…
  • complaining about the wrong (possibly) sub-sub-forum within the Community & Fun subforum…
  • complaining about a play with words that was intended (headine → contents)
  • arguing whether or not the package manager is a defining characteristic or has a defining influence on a distribution
  • arguing whether or not the RPM format is “archaic” when it was created by and for Red Hat in 1997 but actually stems from 1993 in its inspirations and when some distributions have chosen to depart from the Linux Standard Base…
  • arguing whether the package manager is relevant for users at all

Is a bit petty? :p.

And then basically telling someone to go to another forum (that of CentOS) is not hostile?

:p.

I would even consider that mean :p. Now I have to go to a place I don’t like, in order to use software I don’t want? I think that’s really mean.

#7

On 2018-06-08, Knurpht <Knurpht@no-mx.forums.microfocus.com> wrote:
> First :slight_smile:
> [image: https://i.imgur.com/VzyPY71.png]

Yes, but do you start a sentence with openSUSE? openSUSE just looks odd!

Perhaps’s it’d be best to drop the openSUSE bit altogether and just use Leap!

#8

I find myself in agreement with this man.

But leaping is perhaps not the best way to start flying, I don’t know.

That’s why I prefer a little structure to start out from

and that’s OpenSUSE (of course many logos have lower caps but the official common name is still capitalized, so I just write English, although I would probably write openSuSE if I could, but that’s also ‘wrong’, so I just go with English ----- but I’m not here to argue).

#9

I tend to think technical people often do not understand typography,

and try to combine “logo” with “name” because they try to do everything in ASCII,

and Mr. L. Poettering also gets mad when you write SystemD

whereas systemd does not stand out from the text as a common name

and is only written “systemd” because it is the name of a daemon.

Which is like saying “Apache” is wrong because the daemon is httpd_prefork

#10

On 2018-06-08, xen82a <xen82a@no-mx.forums.microfocus.com> wrote:
> And you don’t think that…
<SNIP>
> Is a bit petty? :p.

Of course! GNU/Linux users are pedants! This might be General Chit-Chat, but that’s no reason to let up!

> - complaining about a miss-spelled initial capital in agreement with
> English capitalisation of common names…

You will find that `miss-spelled’ is misspelt.

  • complaining about the wrong (possibly) sub-sub-forum within the
    Community & Fun subforum…

It’s a subforum, not a sub-sub-forum.

  • complaining about a play with words that was intended (headine →
    contents)

It’s not a complaint, but an observation.

  • arguing whether or not the package manager is a defining
    characteristic or has a defining influence on a distribution

These possibilities are not mutually exclusive so your choice of using or' is unwarranted. Moreover, the usage of or
not’ is a redundant tautology at the beginning of the sentence.

  • arguing whether or not the RPM format is “archaic” when it was
    created by and for Red Hat in 1997 but actually stems from 1993 in its
    inspirations and when some distributions have chosen to depart from
    the Linux Standard Base…

No-one but yourself argued whether or not RPM is `archaic’.

> - arguing whether the package manager is relevant for users at all

No - it was argued that the choice of package management is trivial to most users.

> And then basically telling someone to go to another forum (that of
> CentOS) is not hostile?

The suggestion did not preclude any complaint to openSUSE on the openSUSE forum!

> I would even consider that mean :p. Now I have to go to a place I don’t
> like, in order to use software I don’t want? I think that’s really mean.

Actually I am the devil incarnate I am very mean, especially to my students! :stuck_out_tongue:

But seriously, no-one is being hostile here. Just busy! :slight_smile:

#11

You overdo it, I’m just a “Thinks GNU is a funny acronym person”, not a GNU user :p.

It’s not a complaint, but an observation.

Technically that would qualify as unsolicited criticism

Actually I am the devil incarnate I am very mean, especially to my students! :stuck_out_tongue:

I think a rat stole a loaf of bread the other day, was that you as well? :p.

#12

On 2018-06-08, xen82a <xen82a@no-mx.forums.microfocus.com> wrote:
> I think a rat stole a loaf of bread the other day, was that you as well?

Nope. But it was my minion!

#13

Btw, that’s not true.

Many Linux people (let’s just call them technical people)

think they have the highest truth about linguistics, while usually being rather socially inept and not very inclined to be writing prose, for instance.

Ie. the Linux user’s favourite complaint is that combined adjectives such as “mostly” and “all” would be incorrect usage of language, so that when you would say

“mostly everyone” they have an issue with that (cannot think of the correct example right now) because to their mind “everyone” means 100%, and then “mostly” doesn’t mean 100%, and their brain enters mayhem condition.

And then you get debates about perfectly normal English.

But some programmers, basically, decided that they know the truth about proper English and are now going to fight your ideas on the basis that you used an adjective to quality an adjective…

#14

Must be nice to just be able to take on the corporate form you like.

#15

On Fri, 08 Jun 2018 14:36:03 +0000, xen82a wrote:

> I tend to think technical people often do not understand typography,
>
> and try to combine “logo” with “name” because they try to do everything
> in ASCII,
>
> and Mr. L. Poettering also gets mad when you write SystemD
>
> whereas systemd does not stand out from the text as a common name
>
> and is only written “systemd” because it is the name of a daemon.
>
> Which is like saying “Apache” is wrong because the daemon is
> httpd_prefork

Ultimately, the creator of the name gets to decide its usage. “openSUSE”
is a trademark, and used properly, it is lower-case even as a sentence
start. (Professional writer here - I have some experience in this, and
actually have talked with lawyers about it to understand how to use
others’ marks properly in written documentation).

So if Poettering says ‘systemd’ is the name of his piece of software,
that’s what it’s called; not SyStemD or SystemD or systemD - it’s
‘systemd’. He gets to decide that.

Jim

–
Jim Henderson
openSUSE Forums Administrator
Forum Use Terms & Conditions at http://tinyurl.com/openSUSE-T-C

#16

Sure, he gets to decide that with the long end of a gun.

Not very long ago the pope decided that all the lands of the earth were under his dominion, and allowed one of ‘his’ kings, in this case the Spanish one, to basically claim new lands which then murdered millions upon millions of people already living there. See, the pope “decided” what was true, it was just the long end of a gun was used to make this “truth” reality.

#17

Now that’s hostile!

#18

On Fri, 08 Jun 2018 16:26:02 +0000, xen82a wrote:

> hendersj;2868830 Wrote:
>> So if Poettering says ‘systemd’ is the name of his piece of software,
>> that’s what it’s called; not SyStemD or SystemD or systemD - it’s
>> ‘systemd’. He gets to decide that.
>
> Sure, he gets to decide that with the long end of a gun.

That’s the thing about ‘branding’ discussions (and trademarks, registered
or not) - the creator gets full control of how it’s used. So “openSUSE”
is correct, not “OpenSuSE” or “OpenSUSE”. :slight_smile:

Jim

–
Jim Henderson
openSUSE Forums Administrator
Forum Use Terms & Conditions at http://tinyurl.com/openSUSE-T-C

#19

On Fri, 08 Jun 2018 17:14:15 +0000, Jim Henderson wrote:

> On Fri, 08 Jun 2018 16:26:02 +0000, xen82a wrote:
>
>> hendersj;2868830 Wrote:
>>> So if Poettering says ‘systemd’ is the name of his piece of software,
>>> that’s what it’s called; not SyStemD or SystemD or systemD - it’s
>>> ‘systemd’. He gets to decide that.
>>
>> Sure, he gets to decide that with the long end of a gun.
>
> That’s the thing about ‘branding’ discussions (and trademarks,
> registered or not) - the creator gets full control of how it’s used. So
> “openSUSE” is correct, not “OpenSuSE” or “OpenSUSE”. :slight_smile:
>
> Jim

Similarly, ‘gif’ is pronounced ‘jif’, not ‘gif’ (with a hard G) - because
Steve Wilhite, the creator of the format, said it’s pronounced ‘jif’. He
gets to decide that, because he created it. :wink:

Jim

Jim Henderson
openSUSE Forums Administrator
Forum Use Terms & Conditions at http://tinyurl.com/openSUSE-T-C

#20

I am leaving this up, at least for the time being, but I am taking another look at the Guidelines and suggest you might like to do the same.