What happens with you when you die in real (on the internet)

English Open Chat
#1

I browsed in the google disclaimers and was not able to find anything
about what happens to my datas after you die.

The internet is a pretty anonymous place and for the most part no one
will notice if someone is dead anyway.
But what happens to your data. Are relatives allowed to access your data
or can you automatically erase them?

These are essential questions since more and more things are getting
done online. Of course no one like to think about dying but i wonder and
ponder what i can do or what is even possible.

So far my research was not very satisfying.

–

Windows, supports nearly all software, hardware, and viruses.
Linux Counter: 548299 https://linuxcounter.net/

#2

There was a case a while ago, where somebody with a Yahoo mailbox died, and Yahoo refused to give the relatives access to the data.

I don’t remember all of the details. I seem to recall that the relatives (parents, I think) eventually got a court order and then Yahoo made the data available in response to the court order.

I would say this is a case of unsettled law and undeveloped traditions.

If you want your relatives to have access, then give them the password before you die. If you don’t want them to have access, then keep as much as possible encrypted and don’t share the encryption key with anybody.

#3

On 13.02.2012 19:06, nrickert wrote:
>
> JoergJaeger;2440145 Wrote:
>> But what happens to your data. Are relatives allowed to access your data
>> or can you automatically erase them?
>
> There was a case a while ago, where somebody with a Yahoo mailbox died,
> and Yahoo refused to give the relatives access to the data.
>
> I don’t remember all of the details. I seem to recall that the
> relatives (parents, I think) eventually got a court order and then Yahoo
> made the data available in response to the court order.
>
> I would say this is a case of unsettled law and undeveloped traditions.
>
> If you want your relatives to have access, then give them the password
> before you die. If you don’t want them to have access, then keep as
> much as possible encrypted and don’t share the encryption key with
> anybody.
>
>

It seems that we go in the new age without legal preparation to some degree.
Yes, i thought of that too to give it to my wife perhaps. Right now i
have pretty everything running through the internet. I know some people
that still use paper but i advanced or so i think.
I am not sure if you can disclose passwords in to your last will, which
would be official.
Anything else is kind of a gray area.

–

Windows, supports nearly all software, hardware, and viruses.
Linux Counter: 548299 https://linuxcounter.net/

#4

JoergJaeger wrote:

> I browsed in the google disclaimers and was not able to find anything
> about what happens to my datas after you die.
>
> The internet is a pretty anonymous place and for the most part no one
> will notice if someone is dead anyway.
> But what happens to your data. Are relatives allowed to access your data
> or can you automatically erase them?
>
> These are essential questions since more and more things are getting
> done online. Of course no one like to think about dying but i wonder and
> ponder what i can do or what is even possible.
>
> So far my research was not very satisfying.

That can be a very big problem unless you leave your heirs/executors a list
of sites and passwords to servers and services which they will need to
access. A small sampling would be they problems families ran into trying
to access Yahoo accounts of deceased service members a few years back - even
with a court order they were pretty much stymied. You should be able to
find some of the tales through Google.

Another potential frustrating item would be transfer of any domains held in
your name - that can be a flaming bitch to get done! BTDT.

–
Will Honea

#5

The big assumption so far is that your surviving relatives will give a rat’s whatever for all your data. It may seem important to you, but… Probably as useful as some of the physical junk one is left to clear out following the death of even a close relative. If the data is important or valuable, separate it and leave the key(s), the rest can be deleted before you go, to save them the trouble! :slight_smile:

#6

Oh, what a delightful and sunny thematic. I hope you and your relatives are in good health and not depressed. hugs

Well of course it is always a bit uncomfortable to die. One first thought that comes to my mind, is of course, that it may be intended that you WISH your relatives NOT to have access to your data after your death. This for example in case you have an erotic email exchange with a secret lover or what so ever habit tucked away. So maybe the resistance of yahoo wasn’t that bad, after all everybody can write a testament even years before and define what should happen to personal belongings.

In case you should wish to define an away message, you can set it to be started after you haven’t for example accessed for more than one year an account: *

Hello, I am definitely unavailable for the moment. If you want to speak to me, you will have to wait for the afterlife, so be assured that your message will not be read by me personally anymore. So I hoped you behaved when you did write it. Anyway it is too late to go back, the message already arrived here. See it like this, since I am not here any more, if you want to send me what so ever, do it, I couldn’t care less. To Mr. Mumbu Babatunde Miller from Nigeria, thank you so much having thought of me for the million dollar account of your last dictatorship. Given my current status of complete exitus, I will not be able to laundry your money for this time, but I really want to thank your for having had a thought on me. I appreciate. I am also thankful to “Linda” who is already wet and hot and for the 3452 tickets and “accounts for free entry” to the xxx-site, your organization kindly sent to me. That has been very nice too. * *Now I have to go. Be assured: see ya later! *:wink:

Whatever you worry about, write down your testament today (handwritten, if not invalid) and leave in it all the passwords you wish, and all the greetings and indications. Or, just don’t care. I do not think they will come to bother you, once you are dead. Ah, and make sure you give it to somebody or leave it in a place accessible once you left. A testament is worth only if they find it. No testament? No party! :slight_smile:

#7

On 02/14/2012 03:55 AM, JoergJaeger wrote:
> for the most part no one will notice if someone is dead anyway.

i get a spam message from a friend’s yahoo email account about once a
week or so…

that friend died a couple of years ago and the spam started about a year
ago…i’ve reported the spam to yahoo’s bitchsheet on the web about a
dozen times…and, still they come.

i thought about blacklisting, but decided he was a nice enough guy it
does not hurt to think of him every once in a while (besides i may
decide to supersize my lovelife…)

–
DD http://tinyurl.com/DD-Caveat
Read what Distro Watch writes: http://tinyurl.com/SUSEonDW

#8

That is all very enlightening.
And there is some thinking to do and carefully consider what the best
option is.

But how you guy are doing it? Maybe i can learn or get some ideas. Btw.
i imagine that on facebook there must be some people that are decided
and still hanging there as friends.

Normally i don’t expect that anyone will come to my funeral (afterall, i
am a weirdo), but i like to prepare myself in case i am unable for some
reason or i am simply really dead.

Whatever the case is, preparation is key and don’t want to make anyone
suffer to get on important things like bank accounts. Well, that may be
changing too. But i think about our grandma here who now has dementia or
alzheimer. She can not do anything anymore and so i need to make sure i
prepare it either way.

Death is a life event and for all i know, we all will face it some day.
Last time i went over the cementary in my home town i noticed that there
are some people calling it home now, that are younger then me. It made
me think about it. Of course i don’t expect to die anytime soon. But as
this saying goes, the only certainty in life is death and taxes.

–

Windows, supports nearly all software, hardware, and viruses.
Linux Counter: 548299 https://linuxcounter.net/

#9

There are laws that deal with bank accounts.

For passwords that my wife might need, she already has a copy. The others don’t really matter much.

#10

On 2012-02-15 00:26, nrickert wrote:
> For passwords that my wife might need, she already has a copy. The
> others don’t really matter much.

Well, there could be a service, caretakers perhaps, that tell others online
that such person has died, so that they don’t try to reach him and wonder
about the no answer. Or, suppose you had a webpage with documentation
people found useful: it could be passed over to somebody you knew over
internet. An inheritance of sorts. Not everything is giving passwords.

New times need new laws and systems…

–
Cheers / Saludos,

Carlos E. R.
(from 11.4 x86_64 “Celadon” at Telcontar)

#11

There are a few considerations but, think of it, they really apply to who is left. One of the things that really changed is not the password question (that can be easily solved, by just having some relative or a lawyer who has regularly a copy of a master password. The file with the passwords in clear and all important addresses can be in an encrypted file on a backup medium (ideally an HDD and and SSD regularly updated)).
But then what made me think was the sentence you said… new times need new laws and systems. I had an African colleague that was 20 years younger than me. I was averted of her death by her friends (and whom I did not know personally) who apparently still did find my email-address in her program. What is really different these days is that

a) you have friends all over the world, real friends, not fake online ones that couldn’t care less (who has 2500 online friends after half a year may be IMO much more lonely and empty than somebody who has 15 after 5 years). So these physical, real friendships, people that care about you, have no possibility to read the local newspaper to find out that you did die.

b)Maybe they even do not know so much each other in between each other. So an informal network as well as a formal one might not work. In these cases an official register page on the Internet of deceases might be helpful.

c) I am speaking a whole lot of languages. But many of my friends within these language barriers do not. How could they understand an advertisement even on the net if they wouldn’t understand the language.

This however brings forward all new problematics. How to avoid that people “declare” an enemy for dead as a bad hoax or as an act of harassment. The possibility of legal persecution are low with the local newspaper but still they are there BUT the damage is also very local, so the damage is more relative. This not because "the Internet is a law free space with too little control (which is the stereo-typical sentence unqualified politicians like to hear them say on the news) nor because there are pedophiles behind these acts and therefore we have to put a “site blocking” everywhere. The fact is: the cost of communication is incredible low compared to traditional media. Try to put a “death-announcement” on the New York Times. Will they really check the person is dead? I do not think so. But they will belief that spending thousands of dollar on a hoax is not very probable. The Internet (fortunately) does not have those filters. It is very efficient in communication and people take or at least should take notices with the benefit of a doubt. But a kind of official birth announcement registry and/or decease communication site (maybe national one, controlled by the respective administration) may one day a good idea in a globalized world. A private one? Forget it. The important questions are bound to legal status that are directly touching official duties. So IMO such an official register (that must be easily researchable and with an official verifiable responsible administrative postal address) must be of the State. BTW a lot of Universities now do publish lists of all laureates on the Internet, they do this because of repeated cases of “false titles” presented overseas, both sides of the sea intended.
A counterargument against all this would be the digital divide. This will be currently feasible only for the nice “pink and developed ones”. And then, why should it be made easy? It is supposed if you are really interested in a person, now matter how, you will find out what happened to her/him. If not, you won’t and it will be fine that way either, wouldn’t it?

But 90% of the other aspects are not of real importance in my view. Crypt your personal data on the cloud, this is another argument for it. And let’s not forget that we are not sooooo important. World keep on turning I guess.

I have to say that this is to some extend a quite macabre thread.

#12

On 2012-02-15 10:56, stakanov wrote:

> There are a few considerations but, think of it, they really apply to
> who is left.

My relatives or close friend may care very little about Linux online forums :wink:

And if they care about my request, they would know not how to contact.

> But then what made me think was the sentence you said… new times
> need new laws and systems. I had an African colleague that was 20 years
> younger than me. I was averted of her death by her friends (and whom I
> did not know personally) who apparently still did find my email-address
> in her program.

And they contacted you? That was nice.

> What is really different these days is that
>
> a) you have friends all over the world, real friends, not fake online
> ones that couldn’t care less (who has 2500 online friends after half a
> year may be IMO much more lonely and empty than somebody who has 15
> after 5 years). So these physical, real friendships, people that care
> about you, have no possibility to read the local newspaper to find out
> that you did die.

Right.

> b)Maybe they even do not know so much each other in between each other.
> So an informal network as well as a formal one might not work. In these
> cases an official register page on the Internet of deceases might be
> helpful.

Quite…

> c) I am speaking a whole lot of languages. But many of my friends
> within these language barriers do not. How could they understand an
> advertisement even on the net if they wouldn’t understand the language.

True…

> This however brings forward all new problematics. How to avoid that
> people “declare” an enemy for dead as a bad hoax or as an act of
> harassment.

Argh :frowning:

> world. A private one? Forget it. The important questions are bound to
> legal status that are directly touching official duties. So IMO such an
> official register (that must be easily researchable and with an official
> verifiable responsible administrative postal address) must be of the
> State.

Probably…

> And then, why should it be made easy? It is supposed if you are really
> interested in a person, now matter how, you will find out what happened
> to her/him. If not, you won’t and it will be fine that way either,
> wouldn’t it?

If you know the real name, probably…

>
> But 90% of the other aspects are not of real importance in my view.
> Crypt your personal data on the cloud, this is another argument for it.
> And let’s not forget that we are not sooooo important. World keep on
> turning I guess.

Indeed, one way or another it turns.

> I have to say that this is to some extend a quite macabre thread.

No, it is a life subject…

–
Cheers / Saludos,

Carlos E. R.
(from 11.4 x86_64 “Celadon” at Telcontar)

#13

Well, she was a very intelligent and very special person indeed. So she had very intelligent and special friends. And these friends did even more, they did open a memorial website where who liked could remember her, leave messages, anecdotes, photos. It is still online today (since 2007) and people do come bye and leave messages. A lot of them were very attached.
Yes it was very nice indeed.

#14

consused wrote:

>
> The big assumption so far is that your surviving relatives will give a
> rat’s whatever for all your data. It may seem important to you, but…
> Probably as useful as some of the physical junk one is left to clear out
> following the death of even a close relative. If the data is important
> or valuable, separate it and leave the key(s), the rest can be deleted
> before you go, to save them the trouble! :slight_smile:

No, the biggest hassle was one for a fraternal organization. The domain was
primarily used for the forum interface and the guy who set it up had the
domain in his name (mistake #1) hosted on a machine in his basement (mistake
#2). When he croaked swimming laps one morning the family had no interest
in keeping the thing up and running so the fun began. Took us nearly six
months to get everything transfered to the organization’s name and that was
with the help of the Inspector General of a federal agency (he was a
member). The hassle with getting the software transfered from the old
machine was non-trivial - but that is OT to your situation. Had we not had
the juice provided by that member we might still be fighting the battle with
the registrar etc.

–
Will Honea

#15

JoergJaeger wrote:

> Death is a life event and for all i know, we all will face it some day.
> Last time i went over the cementary in my home town i noticed that there
> are some people calling it home now, that are younger then me. It made
> me think about it. Of course i don’t expect to die anytime soon. But as
> this saying goes, the only certainty in life is death and taxes.

Death is a universal disease; sexually transmitted and always fatal :wink:

–
Will Honea

#16

i always share my account with my wife… :stuck_out_tongue:

#17

This site has some useful information.

#18

I think we need some regulations for this.
Yahoo, facebook and any online account should be considered as intellectual property.