Microsoft is Doomed

It’s been said before. But I believe this more so now than ever.

There are a few reasons why Windows 8 is doomed. Chris Woolum (my future son-in-law) brought up the point about mobile phone pervasive success causing the implosion of desktop sales. That might be true to a significant degree. I read another article saying that desktop PC sales are also plunging because the desktop PC which would normally need to be replaced (by a newer, better, faster, yada yada model) are already so good that they don’t need replacement. Older desktop PC’s have plenty of life in them. Well, another thing that is killing new desktop PC sales is Windows 8. The writer of this article seems to agree. Microsoft killed itself with this terrible excuse for a new desktop operating system. It seems also that instead of Microsoft admitting their mistake (like they did with Vista) they’re doubling down on this kludge called Windows 8. The next Windows will be the last nail in the coffin for a once prestigious and glorious American company called Microsoft.

My advice is to hedge your bet and install Linux as an alternative.

Windows: It’s over | ZDNet

On 2013-04-16, Rudemeister <Rudemeister@no-mx.forums.opensuse.org> wrote:
> ‘Windows: It’s over | ZDNet’
> (http://www.zdnet.com/windows-its-over-7000013964/)

Thanks for the link. Another sjvn article… Although I don’t disagree with everything he writes, sometimes I feel he’s
dramatises things to attract attention rather than inform readers.

On 2013-04-16, Rudemeister <Rudemeister@no-mx.forums.opensuse.org> wrote:
> There are a few reasons why Windows 8 is doomed. Chris Woolum (my
> future son-in-law) brought up the point about mobile phone pervasive
> success causing the implosion of desktop sales.

Congratulations to your daughter! Mobile phones and portable tablets can at best only replace desktops for casual
computer use (e.g. emails, browsing, quick letters) but not for anything more substantial (e.g. office applications). I
can’t see desktops disappearing from business applications even if almost all businesses have stuck with Windows 7
rather than use Windows 8, and in terms of general popularity: Windows 7 > Windows XP > Windows Vista > Windows 8 with
Windows 8 enjoying only 2-3% of the Windows market on desktops.

> That might be true to a
> significant degree. I read another article saying that desktop PC sales
> are also plunging because the desktop PC which would normally need to be
> replaced (by a newer, better, faster, yada yada model) are already so
> good that they don’t need replacement.

The drives for bigger faster hardware for home PCs in Windows as far as I could see were games and multimedia. While
consoles are cheaper and can perform both, suddenly everyone wants to play games no more demanding than Angry Birds! I
suspect the only current drive to make hard faster and more efficient is to counter the effects of software becoming
slower and more inefficient :).

> Older desktop PC’s have plenty of
> life in them. Well, another thing that is killing new desktop PC sales
> is Windows 8.

… which would be shame. If households were confined to mobile phones and portable tablets, how would anyone learn
things about computers? When I was about 8, I learnt assembler on a home computer - okay it was 8-bit 6502. Perhaps
the Raspberry Pi has a vital role to play in ensuring computer literacy in the future generation…

> Microsoft
> killed itself with this terrible excuse for a new desktop operating
> system. It seems also that instead of Microsoft admitting their mistake
> (like they did with Vista) they’re doubling down on this kludge called
> Windows 8. The next Windows will be the last nail in the coffin for a
> once prestigious and glorious American company called Microsoft.

I don’t think Microsoft is dead, and I think it would not be healthy for the PC world if it did.

> My advice is to hedge your bet and install Linux as an alternative.

GNU/Linux has consistently failed to challenge the stranglehold Microsoft has on PC, and I can’t see this changing. The
underlying reasons behind this failure IMO are:

  1. Microsoft + bloatware sponsors have monopolised the preinstalled OS market.
  2. GNU/Linux users are treated as second class citizens by many key developers (Adobe, Cisco, etc…).
  3. There are so many `versions’ of Linux, it’s impossible to offer commercial support for all distros.
  4. Your average computer beginner is overwhelmed by the many `versions’ of GNU/Linux.
  5. GNU/Linux and hardware drivers are still not best friends (think of Nvidia).
  6. GNU/Linux is always `broken’ in one area or another (i.e. when you have to drop to command line).
  7. … consequently: GNU/Linux is not free; you just pay with time rather than money.

As Linux becomes `friendlier’, things may improve but I suspect Microsoft will always be one step ahead. Having said
that both my brother and father have recently become so outraged with Windows 8 on their new laptops, I was asked to
install Linux. I’ve now learnt the lesson: openSUSE is not a good suggestion for beginners, for what I now see as very
obvious reasons (e.g. What’s fail-safe? What’s a codec? What’s PulseAudio? Why are there two control panels?). My
experiences of installing Linux Mint for beginners has been much less headache-inducing…

It may go too far to say that “Microsoft is Doomed”. But there can be little doubt that they have made a serious misstep.

To a large extent, Microsoft’s success was because they were perceived as technology leaders, as having the ability to set the agenda in the tech world. That baton has been passed on to Google (with android), and Microsoft knows it. If Windows 8 was an attempt to regain the lost momentum, then it has failed.

Am 16.04.2013 11:54, schrieb flymail:
> I’ve now learnt the lesson: openSUSE is not a good suggestion for beginners, for what I now see as very
> obvious reasons (e.g. What’s fail-safe? What’s a codec? What’s PulseAudio? Why are there two control panels?). My
> experiences of installing Linux Mint for beginners has been much less headache-inducing…

I sadly (because myself I like openSUSE more than Mint) agree with your
assessment it coincides with my own experience.
As we are in general chitchat may I ask you the off topic question which
Mint desktop in your experience turned out to be the best for complete
beginners? I give them Mate but I would be pleased to hear your opinion.

About the general topic, I also think Win 8 will turn out to be a fail,
but I doubt that it will doom MS and I will also doubt it increases the
number of Linux users too much - maybe it increases the number of apple
users or even triggers more effort for android as desktop operating
system on standard hardware.

In the long term MS may loose the battle for the desktop due to their
own errors (Vista did not kill them maybe Win 8 will also not), but I do
not give anything about that the standard GNU/Linux distros will take over.
We (the GNU/Linux community) lost the battle for the desktop for the
broad masses more than a decade ago due to other errors made and this
will not just change right now - other systems will fill that gap.

Just the 2ct my crystal ball tells me without evidence.


PC: oS 12.3 x86_64 | i7-2600@3.40GHz | 16GB | KDE 4.10.0 | GTX 650 Ti
ThinkPad E320: oS 12.3 x86_64 | i3@2.30GHz | 8GB | KDE 4.10.0 | HD 3000
HannsBook: oS 12.3 x86_64 | SU4100@1.3GHz | 2GB | KDE 4.10.0 | GMA4500

Yes, and not surprising as survival depends on attention-grabbing and advertising revenues.

I don’t think Microsoft is dead, and I think it would not be healthy for the PC world if it did.

If it did, what would happen next? Apple Mac sales would probably increase, and if that led to lower prices then they could increase their market share dramatically. It depends on how the other PC manufacturers respond to that situation, and who ends up owning Windows development. Would any of them choose Linux as a replacement? Although I don’t fully agree with all seven deadly issues presented by @flymail under:

GNU/Linux has consistently failed to challenge the stranglehold Microsoft has on PC, and I can’t see this changing. The
underlying reasons behind this failure IMO are:

I haven’t quoted the list, but I do get the overall picture. If a PC manufacturer had to find an alternative OS, they would need to be talking to organizations with commercial experience e.g Attachmate (SUSE Linux/openSUSE), Red Hat (+Fedora), Canonical (Ubuntu), and maybe also look at Mint and Debian. Then there is Google and Oracle to consider… I expect I left someone out? They probably already know the kernel developers. :slight_smile:

As Linux becomes `friendlier’, things may improve but I suspect Microsoft will always be one step ahead.

Open-source development gives them that advantage, even if they don’t need it.

On 2013-04-16 11:54, flymail wrote:

> GNU/Linux has consistently failed to challenge the stranglehold Microsoft has on PC, and I can’t see this changing. The
> underlying reasons behind this failure IMO are:
>
> 1. Microsoft + bloatware sponsors have monopolised the preinstalled OS market.
> 2. GNU/Linux users are treated as second class citizens by many key developers (Adobe, Cisco, etc…).
> 3. There are so many `versions’ of Linux, it’s impossible to offer commercial support for all distros.

  1. Your average computer beginner is overwhelmed by the many versions' of GNU/Linux. &gt; 5. GNU/Linux and hardware drivers are still not best friends (think of Nvidia). &gt; 6. GNU/Linux is always broken’ in one area or another (i.e. when you have to drop to command line).
    > 7. … consequently: GNU/Linux is not free; you just pay with time rather than money.
  1. You need Windows to interact with gadgets, that come only with a
    Windows only application to install updates and things.

Samples: TomTom navigator, cell-phones like Nokia, epubs… yes, there
is some support in Linux for some of those things, but limited.

You can not, for example, activate a paid ebook with drm in Linux, you
need Adobe - unless you break the encryption, which is against the law
in some/few/many countries.


Cheers / Saludos,

Carlos E. R.
(from 12.1 x86_64 “Asparagus” at Telcontar)

Similar theme https://forums.opensuse.org/english/other-forums/community-fun/general-chit-chat/484069-windows8-killed-desktop-pc.html

On 2013-04-16, Martin Helm <martin_helm@no-mx.forums.opensuse.org> wrote:
> I sadly (because myself I like openSUSE more than Mint) agree with your
> assessment it coincides with my own experience.
> As we are in general chitchat may I ask you the off topic question which
> Mint desktop in your experience turned out to be the best for complete
> beginners? I give them Mate but I would be pleased to hear your opinion.

Excellent question, even if off topic :). I refuse to install Linux entirely on my own on the machines of friends/family
because I want them to take at least some responsibility for the installation and take an active interest. I am however
happy to supervise them doing it THEMSELVES. There are three advantages of this approach. First, they are forced to
at least have some idea of knowledge of the basic issues and common stumbling blocks (especially with laptop dualboots)
that will make their lives easier (e.g. what is a distro? what is a partition?). Second, by being involved they are more
likely to feel the excitement of trying something new and exercise their curiosity in exploring developments and solving
problems themselves before asking me. Lastly, it allows me to ensure the installation is suited to their needs rather
than based on my own prejudices.

So before the `visit’ I demand the following things before touching the machine:

  1. Backup all data and construct a Windows repair disk.
  2. Defragment all partitions or if a desktop, purchase a new SSD.
  3. Play with the 4 Live versions to decide on a desktop environment (MATE, Cinnamon, KDE, XFCE).
  4. Have a good bottle red wine ready and be prepared to write off an evening (especially for a laptop).

So the answer to your question is I encourage them to decide. If they can’t decide `because they all seem very similar’
I install KDE because it’s the only desktop environment I know it and can show off things like plasmoid activities. To
me it makes no difference because I just use ssh whenever I need to rescue their system remotely, but I must admit to
missing ncurses YaST whenever I do…

@flymail: perfect answer, thank you


PC: oS 12.3 x86_64 | i7-2600@3.40GHz | 16GB | KDE 4.10.0 | GTX 650 Ti
ThinkPad E320: oS 12.3 x86_64 | i3@2.30GHz | 8GB | KDE 4.10.0 | HD 3000
HannsBook: oS 12.3 x86_64 | SU4100@1.3GHz | 2GB | KDE 4.10.0 | GMA4500

On 2013-04-16, Martin Helm <martin_helm@no-mx.forums.opensuse.org> wrote:
> @flymail: perfect answer, thank you

Pleasure - good to know you like red wine too :).

Microsoft has been able to heavily influence hardware and every other aspect of computing due to their historic monopoly position But as their monopoly diminishes, so does their ability to dictate direction to the industry. I think a case in point is UEFI. There are some good technical reasons to replace the archaic BIOS, but Microsoft has leveraged the technical reasons to their advantage. Microsoft shot themself in the foot with that dreadful Metro interface. They are not doomed to extinction, but they are doomed to lose the importance they once enjoyed. You reap what you sow.

The problem with predictions like this is that they don’t take into account that anybody may not continue on their path blindly, and that people and companies do look at reactions and feedback and adjust their course.

Microsoft’s Windows 8 Plan B (lue): Bring back the Start button, boot to desktop

I am not convinced they are going to do this, honestly, but that doesn’t mean they won’t consider it or adjust what they can control to possibly better or possibly worse effects.

I do believe that Microsoft is going to slide from their prominent position, and their time “on top of the heap” (consumer market) is more-or-less over. Considering where they are coming from, even dropping 50% brings them multiples larger than Apple! Not to mention, who is going to fill in the gap?

[ul]
[li]Phones and tablets are going to eat away at the desktop market.[/li][LIST]
[li]Tablets provide a more comfortable form factor (like looking at paper or a book) while phones provide the (always on) connectivity. The only advantages the traditional desktop and laptop offer are larger screens (desktops) and accessible keyboards on-the-go (laptops). [/li][li]In the past one would upgrade your system to get access to bigger and better programs, hold more of your stuff, and to play with the newest gadgets. Now the tablet and phone markets generate that excitement with new gadgets, forms and Apps. [/li][li]I hear of more and more people who buy a tablet and finds they aren’t using their destkop/laptop much, if at all, since. [/li][li]Don’t discount that Smart TVs are also growing which takes the place of having to use a computer to watch streamed video or shows over cable or something. [/li][li]Unfortunately Linux still does not have anybody in these markets other than Android. Ubuntu Phone / Ubuntu Touch and Mozilla OS are still trying to get started and are even behind Microsoft in terms of number of Apps available (something consumers, which this is focused towards, care for). So this makes Apple and Google first in line to eat Microsoft’s dog food (and that’s exactly what they are doing) [/li][/ul]

[li]Hardware out-accelerated software[/li][ul]
[li]I think Netbooks started it, showing that people don’t need super-powered systems to do what they want to do and emphasized other more important benefits; connectivity (anywhere) and long battery life, in addition to being cheap. [/li][li]Also, as more things move to the “cloud”, the requirements of the local system becomes little more than to run a browser (thus the concept behind Google Chrome OS). [/li][li]What doesn’t help is that, I read this in a blog somewhere, while tablet screens are packing in the pixels, laptop and desktop screens are similar to their older resolutions. I wish I could find the article and link to it though. [/li][li]Unfortunately, while Linux has improved tremendously with hardware detection there are still some issues with newer systems and the UEFI safe-boot situation. [/li][li]Fortunately Linux does work better on older systems and with less resources so providing new life to systems that cannot handle Windows updates or is secondary to a tablet/et. al. Breathing new life into these systems is what Linux is poised to taking advantage of. [/li][/ul]

[li]Windows 8’s effect[/li][ul]
[li]Some people still need or prefer desktops/laptops (developers, graphic designers, gamers). Of these people you have the ones that are going to get it regardless of what it has running on. Then you have the people “on the fence”. These “on the fence” people may hold off on buying a new system until they either can become more comfortable with Windows 8, wait to see what “Windows 9” will bring, or may look at alternatives (including Linux and OS X). [/li][li]Enterprises are more cautious and are less likely to jump to Windows 8 if they don’t need to. They will likely stick with Windows 7 as long as possible (eschewing the sales numbers). This may mean holding off on hardware purchases or migrating to a thin-client or web-based environment (I know ours is moving to a Windows 2008RT thin client scenario). [/li][/ul]

[/LIST]

Notice, Windows 8 is only one, and I think a not-so-big one, of the factors in the reduction of the desktop computer. Some may even say, though, that this drop in the desktop computer validates Microsoft’s move to Windows 8! Think of it, people are complaining how Windows 8 works so lousy on the desktop, and not so much criticism about its use on a touch device (tablets).

I am thinking Windows 8 is not a complete failure, but Microsoft dropped the ball for traditional desktops and laptops where people want a more Windows 7 like interface. If they do bring back the Start button and make the Modern interface an option (for laptops and desktops) or default for tablets then there should be less resistance. Best bet is to keep each available as people want and people will cross-over even just to “try it”.

I just hope Linux can take advantage of the coming changes, and not just by putting it on a tablet or phone either. Somehow make the repurposed desktop or laptop computer extend and enhance tablets (hook up for enhancements or adding new apps, backup and synchronize, recreate the tablet experiences with the advantage of full-sized keyboard and monitor, I dunno).

Wow,… sorry for the long rant. I didn’t realize how much I typed.

I need a desktop for video editing. For a typical 1 hour home video in HD, with AVCHD clips transcoded to DNxHD (using Kdenlive), I need about 300 GiB storage space, if not more. Having a hard drive comes in handy for that. The cloud would cost me way too much money for that kind of storage, and likely would be too slow for rendering videos. The six cores in my PC make a huge difference over the old single core machine! I really need the speed, a tablet just won’t do. I’m sure desktops will be used by fewer people (already are, I guess), but I don’t see why they have to go away. Anyway, I doubt Microsoft will disappear, just be less significant. And don’t get me wrong, I’m not hating on tablets, they’re just not for me.

On Wed 17 Apr 2013 11:26:01 PM CDT, HighBloodSugar wrote:

I need a desktop for video editing. For a typical 1 hour home video in
HD, with AVCHD clips transcoded to DNxHD (using Kdenlive), I need about
300 GiB storage space, if not more.

Hi
Is that a typo… 300 GiB or should that be 300 MiB

I have numerous movies on an SD card for my ASUS TF101 tablet, perfect
for our son to watch when going to visit relatives etc. Handbrake does
a nice job of converting to mpeg4.


Cheers Malcolm °¿° (Linux Counter #276890)
openSUSE 12.3 (x86_64) Kernel 3.7.10-1.1-desktop
up 1:23, 3 users, load average: 0.15, 0.08, 0.06
CPU Intel® i5 CPU M520@2.40GHz | GPU Intel® Arrandale

It’s not a typo. For Kdenlive to handle AVCHD clips, they have to be transcoded into a format that has less compression. Otherwise, trying to edit the clips causes various problems (grey video frames, choppy preview in the editor to name a couple of problems I had using AVCHD clips as-is). DNxHD clips are about 10 times larger than the original AVCHD clips, so 30 GiB of AVCHD becomes roughly 300 GiB of DNxHD clips. The final render is done as mp4 or whatever you like, that one is much smaller. This is the recommended method on the Kdenlive website & forums. If you don’t need to do editing, Handbrake would be fine, I guess. I have a 2 TiB hard drive, so space is not a problem.

On Thu 18 Apr 2013 12:26:01 AM CDT, HighBloodSugar wrote:

malcolmlewis;2548647 Wrote:
> Hi
> Is that a typo… 300 GiB or should that be 300 MiB
>
> I have numerous movies on an SD card for my ASUS TF101 tablet, perfect
> for our son to watch when going to visit relatives etc. Handbrake does
> a nice job of converting to mpeg4.
>
> –
> Cheers Malcolm °¿° (Linux Counter #276890)
> openSUSE 12.3 (x86_64) Kernel 3.7.10-1.1-desktop
> up 1:23, 3 users, load average: 0.15, 0.08, 0.06
> CPU Intel® i5 CPU M520@2.40GHz | GPU Intel® Arrandale

It’s not a typo. For Kdenlive to handle AVCHD clips, they have to be
transcoded into a format that has less compression. Otherwise, trying to
edit the clips causes various problems (grey video frames, choppy
preview in the editor to name a couple of problems I had using AVCHD
clips as-is). DNxHD clips are about 10 times larger than the original
AVCHD clips, so 30 GiB of AVCHD becomes roughly 300 GiB of DNxHD clips.
The final render is done as mp4 or whatever you like, that one is much
smaller. This is the recommended method on the Kdenlive website &
forums. If you don’t need to do editing, Handbrake would be fine, I
guess. I have a 2 TiB hard drive, so space is not a problem.

Hi
Ahhh that makes sense now :wink: Yes most of mine are just conversion and
placing on my little server that runs twonkymedia, from that I can
stream to my notebook(s), the tablet and also have a MKII 802
android device connected to the TV via HDMI. When necessary I just copy
a selection to the tablet sd card…


Cheers Malcolm °¿° (Linux Counter #276890)
openSUSE 12.3 (x86_64) Kernel 3.7.10-1.1-desktop
up 2:46, 3 users, load average: 0.06, 0.06, 0.05
CPU Intel® i5 CPU M520@2.40GHz | GPU Intel® Arrandale

I’ll try and add another:

I use Mint Mate for customers, currently v 13 LTS and Chrome browser added.

Ummmm…just no.