Hi all.
I thought zypper dup was made for dist upgrade (e.g. one Milestone to the next/release to release).
While trying to do a zypper dup on m7 it suggests the following changes:
So will that downgrade me to m6 again?
Best Regards
Marcus
What is the base for the statement you make? There is no single package version listed in your paste.
What do you mean with ‘base for the statement’. As mentioned I am doing a zypper dup on a freshly installed m7 (without 3rd party repos) and it tries to upgrade the packages mentioned in the paste. So m7 is the ‘base’.
The question is: why does a zypper dup upgrade/replace so many packages on the same release. One thing I could imagine is that it also installs the pullin packages which zypper up won’t (yast would do so, but I am not using yast for package management if ever possible).
The other option is that the files on the iso image differ from the ones on the release tree.
If you need any more verbose output, just let me know the exact commands.
Best Regards
Marcus
First notice, that M7 is a development release, meant for testing purposes, not ready for production use.
To find out what’s realy going on, please post output of:
zypper lr -d
Hi,
Sorry, but I know that milestones are development snapshots, otherwise I would not have started this thread in the Pre-Release forum.
It’s more a general question about how dup works.
Btw. here is the requested output:
# | Alias | Name | Aktiviert | Aktualisieren | Priorität | Typ | URI | Dienst
--+--------------+-----------------------+-----------+---------------+-----------+------+--------------------------------------------------------------+-------
1 | repo-non-oss | openSUSE-11.3-Non-Oss | Ja | Ja | 99 | NONE | http://download.opensuse.org/distribution/11.3/repo/non-oss/ |
2 | repo-oss | openSUSE-11.3-Oss | Ja | Ja | 99 | NONE | http://download.opensuse.org/distribution/11.3/repo/oss/ |
3 | repo-update | openSUSE-11.3-Update | Ja | Ja | 99 | NONE | http://download.opensuse.org/update/11.3/ |
And here is a verbose dup output:
http://paste.michal.hrusecky.net/index.php/view/74737244
Cheers
Marcus
Don’t you need the factory oss and non-oss to get the latest updates to the build.
I also have factory kde and gnome. Bleeding edge stuff…
hmm, not sure if it’s up to me, but I thought I asked a clear question?!?
So once again:
why does zypper dup reinstall/pullin so many packages on the same release?
Best Regards
Marcus
Because the content of the repos has changed since the release of M7. A zypper dup tells your system to switch to the new version in the repos, so it will do that and install all packages from that repo. A distribution upgrade, yes.
From your questions I get the idea, that you are not aware of the fact that M7 is not a released ditribution version, it’s a development release. This means it’s a work in progress, where the progress results in creation of lots of updates and new packages.
If you run openSUSE Factory, you’re in this all the time. Over 3GB of updates a couple of times a week is not exceptional. And all this to have a non-booting (can be fixed most of the time) system from time to time
All the kernel packages hadn’t been updated this morning, so I had to opt out of the kernel update.
But yes, 3GB of updates is common every few days or less.
If you are experimenting with beta releases @MarcusMoeller, why not just mess about and see. It’s good to practice.
Because the content of the repos has changed since the release of M7
Hmm, but why will a dup try to re-install so many packages. Let’s take a look at an example:
zypper dup is going to reinstall yast2-tv with version :
2.19.3-1.20
rpm -q yast2-tv # before zypper dup
yast2-tv-2.19.3-1.20.noarch
So a dup will simply reinstall a lot of packages, without a version change.
From your questions I get the idea, that you are not aware of the fact that M7 is not a released ditribution version, it’s a development release. This means it’s a work in progress, where the progress results in creation of lots of updates and new packages.
From what I can see, a Milestone is more a frozen snapshot which will not retrieve that many updates. dup from one Milestone to the next should be possible.
And I know that it’s not rolling like Factory.
To make it clear once again: I just want to learn more about how zypper dup works and why it re-installs/pulls in so many packages if done on the same version.
Best Regards
Marcus
A Milestone release is not just some factory snapshot. It’s part of the road map to 11.3, call it a beta if you want. “zypper dup” from one Milestone to the next is possible, though officially suggested only for testing.
Zypper pulls in these packages because it sees the moving to the repos as a vendor change. If you do not change anything and run ‘zypper dup’ again after the first time, you’ll see that it will not reinstall. You moved from M7 to 11.3 repos (yep I know about the paths on download.opensuse.org, don’t know how they linked it), let’s put it that way.
You can also do that, but it has little to do with milestone testing.
IIRC, after the release of a milestone (the tested development release) the milestone repos (the Factory distribution) can be in any state and get updated - usually once a week (thursdays). Eventually you can zypper dup to the next milestone release using those repos on its announcement, but on a weekly basis, stability can degrade as development bugs are introduced.
we are getting closer to the answer 
a zypper dup also tracks the pullin packages, this is why there are a lot of new packages will be installed (e.g. flash-player …).
packages are going to be reinstalled because zypper dup detects a vendor change (not sure why, but I guess it’s an rpm query so likely ‘Distribution’/‘Vendor’ is different.)
Is that correct?
Best Regards
Marcus
Don’t know about your first statement, could be the packages belong to an installed pattern, second one is correct AFAIK, i.e. vendor change.
Cheers,
Gertjan
Zypper dup will change vendor, whereas zypper up will not even do it to satisfy a dependency. That’s what the official openSUSE Documentation claims.
The question is why there is a vendor change from the install media to the online repo? And why are packages of the same version number going to be re-installed? Only because there is a different vendor available?
I thought vendor change will only happen if there is a newer version available in a repo with a different vendor, not on the same version.
Best Regards
Marcus
Technically, we are not dealing with the install media, since you zypper dup on an installed system.
You are trying to apply the rules to an unstable situation called “factory distribution” where timing is everything, and the tools (zypper/rpm) are possibly themselves being worked on from a need to fix bugs, even if they are not being developed. As I explained, between milestones is an unstable time to be updating from the factory distribution. You have to live with what you arrive at, or try to update it (zypper dup) to a new level of stability. If you don’t want vendor changes and you are happy with package downgrades or removals to resolve dependency issues, then use zypper up between milestones. Just don’t expect stability or a forensic examination by others “post factum”, when dealing with factory distributions. :\
Thought I made it clear. I don’t expect anything. Just want to understand how dup works.
If zypper dup vendor changes, equal to the package version, I personally find it a bit dangerous. Also I am not sure how zypper dup will behave if there are several vendors available offering the same package. Will it then vendor change to the one with the latest version? (And yes, I know, this is unsupported, so please be so kind and just answer my questions).
Best Regards
Marcus
Technically, we are not dealing with the install media, since you zypper dup on an installed system.
Besides that you can also try a zypper dup on the live media, which behaves exactly the same (as expected).
Best Regards
Marcus
Then you won’t be disappointed. If you genuinely want to know how it works now, why not do your experiments on a test installation of 11.2. That would provide a more controlled environment. Some of us successfully used zypper dup on 11.2 milestones last year. First check the release notes and the wiki for any advice.
I didn’t say it was unsupported, I said it was UNSTABLE and therefore unreliable for any forensic examination.
But, according to your original post, that is not what you did.