When in Yast Software Management (OpenSuSE 11.1, KDE 4.2.4), the versions of software installed are often incorrect. For example,
Package…Installed…(Available)
kde4-dolphin…4.2.4-1.11.(4.1.3-3.8.9)…<— in RED
Yet, in the Versions tab:
4.2.4-1.11-x86_64 (installed)
4.1.3-3.8.9-x86_64 from repo-update
4.2.4-1.11-x86_64 from KDE:42
4.1.3-60.11-x86_64 from Education
4.1.3-3.5-x86_64 from repo-oss
Hmm, so Yast cannot calculate which is the most recent version?
This is likewise the case on many apps throughout, not just KDE apps and not just regarding these repos.
Please don’t lecture me about having too many repos. That is not the issue. Yast is able to report the versions in the version tab, but it cannot determine which number is greater than the other?
YET…
Package…Installed (Available)
kde4-keditbookmarks…(4.1.3-3.8.9)…<—In BLACK
obviously not installed, but the Version tab reports:
4.1.3-3.8.9-x86_64 from repo-update
4.2.4-1.11-x86_64 from KDE:42
4.1.3-60.11-x86_64 from Education
Why does it show 4.1.3 available, but not 4.2.4?
Priorites are all on 99, except openSUSE-11.1-update at 20.
Man, this is such a mess! Isn’t there any way for SuSE to get a hold on the repo problems? I know there have been some attempts, but then issues like this mess it up.
Anyway, why should the number of repos matter? If Education (for example) has a package and KDE42 has another why can’t Yast tell the difference between which is the more appropriate? Isn’t that what we rely on it for?
There are some important functions missing from Yast that would naturally have been added. For example, why can’t you filter to see just those that are blue or those that are red. When you choose to update a file, then there are dependency problems and you cancel it is still marked for update! This is a serious oversight. On top of these is the version discrimination between repos.
Ok, I admit Yast is a solid package manager. Still, there are these and other seemingly small features that could push it to the next level and prevent many problems for the user.
I have a problem with this. Plasma addons and plasma quick access do not exist apart from kde4-plasma naming scheme. I am trying to go through my list of installed kde4-* named apps and replace them, but it is not straight forward at all. There were many other renaming schemes and splitting of packages, etc… How can anyone manage this mess?
None of the problems you are experiencing would exist if you held to default repo’s
oss
non-oss
updates
(packman)
You have opted to go in to kde4 packages which did not ship with 11.1
It is easily managed with experience, but until you have that experience it would be better to stick to what was shipped in kde or use kde3 or gnome.
Most of the other community repo’s should be ok for installing odd applications you absolutely need.
Thanks for the tips, but the first statement is going to make me laugh! You really think that this should provide everything I need? Yet, you don’t know what I need?
Kontact was not included in KDE 4.2.4 when I upgraded. Then when I added it, it required KDE 4.2.95! I have not added any KDE repos that were not recommended here. There were packaging problems. Now that one has been sorted out. There is Kontact for 4.2.4.
Listen, VLC is not provided there. Playing video from the net is not widely supported in SuSE. Many times I download a video and I have to try two or three apps to find one that works. Not a single one of them works on all versions of all codecs. Don’t get me started on other apps and hardware issues that I need to add additional repos to find what I need and to keep it up to date. You cannot be serious telling someone you don’t even know that they really only need what you yourself use.
The only reason some people end up complaining so much is because of these kinds of solutions. Is there really no way to solve the version problem aside from paring down repos to the bare minimum? So you are admitting that Yast cannot distinguish properly between versions? My gosh!
I have found a bug report on this by another user. They have similar, though slightly different results. Manually selecting from Version tab is a real pain when you rely on the software to manage this sort of simplicity. I’ve added my notes above to the bug report. This is a problem that has existed since previous versions of SuSE. I hope it gets addressed. One of the promotions of SuSE 11.1 was that Yast had had serious overhauls and was greatly improved. That might have been true in certain areas, but not in this highly visible and immensely frustrating area. We’ll see with the next version, though I don’t have high hopes since Novell bought SuSE.
The only way Yast would provide something that you’re describing is if you have the priorities of your repositories set in an incorrect way. If you tell YAST that you want the Updates repository to have priority over the KDE repositories then it’s going to tell you to install the (4.1.3) packages from the update repository since they have higher priority, even though YOU know that the 4.2.4 packages from the KDE 4.2 repository are newer.
Caf’s information was correct, to
set update repo to 99 priority with all the others
oss and non-oss to 120
In Software management - Filter by repo
select 42 desktop and do Update all in this list Unconditionally and the same for the community 42
When you set the Update repository to 99, it will have the same priority as the KDE repository. Thus, instead of trying to take the kde 4.1.3 packages from the update repository, Yast will recognize the 4.2.4 packages from the KDE 4.2 repository as higher and recognize them as up-to-date.
When I said everything you need I was refering to your comment:
Plasma addons and plasma quick access
Not a generalization of all and sundry.
The only reason some people end up complaining so much is because of these kinds of solutions. Is there really no way to solve the version problem aside from paring down repos to the bare minimum? So you are admitting that Yast cannot distinguish properly between versions? My gosh!
You don’t understand do you. It’s not versions at issue, it’s different versions and different named packages.
As I say, unless you understand what you are doing, (you obviously don’t), stick with the basic minimum.
Look for eg:
amarok versions and names, with the repo’s you have there will be:
kde4-amarok 2 from updates
kde4-amarok 2 from oss
amarok 2 from kde42
amarok 1.4 from packman and various sub versions related to it
did I miss any?
the stable version promoted on KDE’s website
Umm… what does that have to do with openSUSE. I agree the packages are available, and are talked about and written about on openSUSE, there are even guides to installing it.
But understand this: There are NO guarantees!!
I quote from the intro to my HowTo:
This HowTo is to assist users in achieving a working installation of KDE4.2.
It should be noted that in SUSE 11.1 the official version is KDE 4.1.3 and the repositories we are using here are from the Build Service (repositories used in the development of openSUSE). Though in this case the repositories have been specially setup at the time of writing to ensure a stable running KDE4.2.* (but not guaranteed) The (.) means it can change as development progresses.
I mean think about it. How many software repositories can you add to Windows? None!
Install software - yes. But it’s mostly not M$ stuff because they don’t give you ow’t for now’t. Install away and see how easy it is to screw up a M$ system.
I’m not sure that’s such a good comparison, but it was meant to illustrate to you: How MUCH software you do get even with the minimum repo’s.
We try and help you and you rant on about Yast. Just doesn’t help
What doesn’t help is that there is no real conversation about it. Is this only a help forum? When something is an authentic bug there is an assumption that it is the user’s fault. Get off your high horse. I was trying to determine whether this was a bug or if there was some other explanation. You’ll probably kick me off the forum now for replying to you according to what you’ve started, but before you do consider the following:
You’re preaching to the choir. I don’t take the personal insult that I don’t know what I’m doing very well. Please back off a bit.
I’ve found a bug report already reported by another user, so it is not just me. Besides, I do know what I am doing. I do know also what Yast claims to be. It has nothing to do with KDE being 4.1.x or 4.2.x or 3.x.x … It has to do with Yast not being able to distinguish between a higher numbered and lower numbered file by exactly the same name. Read the original post again. I gave precise data. I took TIME to type all that crap out. It has absolutely nothing to do with the renaming scheme.
As for the renaming and my example of Plasma, it was merely an example. Whether Plasma is a necessity or not is arguable, but I could give a rats ass. I don’t think Amarok is an essential either. I avoid it like the plague. So we could get into a spitting contest over software that we like or dislike. That is quite useless though in relation to the post.
I wanted to know whether this was a bug or not. If not, whether there was an answer to why it occurs. I carefully documented it and presented it that way.
As for the Dolphin assumption you made at the beginning, there was no data given that said I had two dolphins installed. As I look right now there is only kde4-dolphin. I searched for Dolphin and there is no package only named Dolphin.
You didn’t make the point, although you should have. Yast is giving this discrepancy because the higher version of file is not from an officially recognized repo. Yet Yast allows you to verify that you trust a repo and to install it’s signature. But when you want to see which packages require updating based on your trusted repos, Yast takes over and demotes higher files from other repos. Am I right?
This is a good explanation, of tyranny, but still an explanation. However, it does not explain the data I presented:
Package…Installed (Available)
kde4-keditbookmarks…(4.1.3-3.8.9)…<—In BLACK
obviously not installed, but the Version tab reports:
4.1.3-3.8.9-x86_64 from repo-update
4.2.4-1.11-x86_64 from KDE:42
4.1.3-60.11-x86_64 from Education
What gives? There is a higher version that Yast lists from one of my trusted repos. Yet, Yast doesn’t even tell me it is available in the package list.
And how does that explain the data? I said the priorities were set at 99. I have the version I want installed. However, I am given mixed messages by Yast. (No one argued that Cal’s info was incorrect, just his judgment).
Package…Installed…(Available)
kde4-dolphin…4.2.4-1.11.(4.1.3-3.8.9)…<— in RED
Yast reports a lower number as being available, but not the higher of the lower numbers…look here:
In the Versions tab:
4.2.4-1.11-x86_64 (installed)
4.1.3-3.8.9-x86_64 from repo-update
4.2.4-1.11-x86_64 from KDE:42
4.1.3-60.11-x86_64 from Education
4.1.3-3.5-x86_64 from repo-oss
4.1.3-60.11-x86_64 from Education is higher, but not reported as available. Only the officially Yast sanctioned repos are reported. That means that the repos the user trusts are not reported in the package list versions? Really?
So I am only repeating what has been said to you with pretty pictures so you can follow along. People help voluntarily and thankless people drive the contributors away, and rarely get the assistance they need.
RED means update available if the user sets a repo with higher priority that has an older package, then it is the users fault. So either you know how to manage repos or you don’t I’ll let you decide…
Seriously? I think you need to calm down. I’ve never been met with so much hostility from someone I’ve tried to HELP. Nowhere in my post did I call you a liar or even hint at being hostile towards you. I simply explained what was happening.
No one here is trying to call you a liar or trying to do anything at all except for help. That’s all I was trying to do is help you understand what was happening. You can look at any posts I’ve ever made, you could look at my reputation and see I’ve never received a negative reputation point. I’m not here to fight with people, I’m here to share what I understand so that others may understand. I love linux, and I love this forum for the help, hard-work, and dedication the forum members put into it. I’m just telling you right now, that if I offended you in any way, I’m sorry. It was not my intention. I’m here to try to help you, as is Caf4926.
Being still a little new to linux, I’ve had the same doubts and concerns with Yast. I was baffled at how idiotic it could be sometimes! But then I learned about how repositories are managed and how Yast handles packages differently depending on the priorities that each individual repository is given. Feathermonkey gave a perfect demonstration of how the update repository being given a higher priority will reproduce the same problem you had, and how switching it to 99 solves it. It has nothing to do with trusted repositories or community repositories. It all has to do with the priority you give each repository.
Yes I did read the original post, and was trying to emphasize what caf4926 was saying by explaining, in detail, how Yast works and trying to explain in further detail what caf was trying to explain.
Once again, thank you Feathermonkey for providing screenshots to help show what caf and I were trying, but failing to explain. And recraig2, sorry if I offended you in any way.
You should have it sorted now with all that info.
We don’t intend to offend FYI.
But you come across kind of bullish.
Anyway. It’s NOT a bug. Understand?
The priorities is the key as has been well explained and demonstrated by my friends.
Some of the name changes I was refering to have not occured yet in the kde42 repo, but I’m using Factory and quite a number more have occured here, so I may have miss-quoted about dolphin (kde4-dolphin).
Spit on amarok all you like. I don’t give a monkey’s what not’s. But as media players go, it’s ‘The Dog’s B*llocks’
Since you read my original post you were certainly calling me a liar. I already said the priorities were all set exactly the same at 99, save that one at 20. It is NOT about priorities. ALL are set to 99. You read that and yet you still wrote in a snide manner and yet expected me not to get upset. You are joking!
