What is the proper .iso file, including all updates, for the installation of openSUSE-11.4 software?

2009Newbie · August 1, 2011, 11:42pm

Hello. I think openSUSE 11.4 was expected to be publicly released on March 10, 2011; I assume it was. During April 17-18, 2011 I made an online upgrade from openSUSE 11.3 to 11.4.—That is I obtained and probably installed the needed files for that upgrade while connected to the Internet and did not obtain the needed files for that upgrade from a Recordable Digital Video Disc (DVD-R). Since April 18, 2011 I have downloaded from the Internet and installed a number of updates to openSUSE-11.4 software. But I thought it would also be good to have the installation files for openSUSE 11.4 on a DVD-R from which I could boot my computer in case in the future I might want to reinstall openSUSE 11.4 while offline and/or perhaps after updates to openSUSE-11.4 are no longer available from the Internet. I would normally prefer that that .iso (International Organization for Standardization) file to be downloaded be the latest version available of it, including updates, that still allows a 32-bit computer to run well. I think the openSUSE classifications for its .iso file seem to fall under the classifications of “stable” and “development.” In July of 2011 I downloaded the stable release by a “Direct Link” for a “32-bit” computer. Comparing the md5 check sum for the file I downloaded, it has the same md5 check sum as in the file openSUSE-11.4-i586.iso.md5 dated March 9, 2011 and obtainable on July 21-22, 2011 from Index of /opensuse/distribution/11.4/iso/. So I presume I obtained the March 2, 2011 version of the file openSUSE-11.4-DVD-i586.iso, which is also in the Web directory of the file openSUSE-11.4-DVD.i586.iso.md5.

But probably numerous updates to openSUSE-11.4 software were produced and publicly distributed between March 10, 2011 and July 21, 2011, which I would not expect to have been included in the openSUSE-11.4 .iso file dated March 9, 2011. Maybe on July 21, 2011 I should instead have obtained the development version of the openSUSE-11.4 .iso file in order for it to have included all of the updates to the .iso file for the installation of openSUSE 11.4. On the other hand, not having been a developer of openSUSE software myself and preferring to use a version of openSUSE which runs well, I would not want a version of openSUSE 11.4 that would not run well or would have major problems. So would the development version of openSUSE 11.4 instead have been the correct choice for me to have made, given these criteria? If not, please instruct me in detail on what the classifications stable and development in practice mean.–Or else how could and should one best obtain from the Internet the kind of up-to-date version of openSUSE 11.4 that I have been discussing? Thanks in advance for any teaching of me that any of you might do here.

hendersj · August 2, 2011, 12:18am

On Mon, 01 Aug 2011 21:46:03 +0000, 2009Newbie wrote:

> But probably numerous updates to openSUSE-11.4 software were produced
> and publicly distributed between March 10, 2011 and July 21, 2011, which
> I would not expect to have been included in the openSUSE-11.4 .iso file
> dated March 9, 2011.

Correct. Updates are not included in the released ISO.

> Maybe on July 21, 2011 I should instead have
> obtained the development version of the openSUSE-11.4 .iso file in order
> for it to have included all of the updates to the .iso file for the
> installation of openSUSE 11.4.

Use the ‘development’ version if you want to test pre-release. If you
want 11.4, then you need to get the base ISO and install the updates.
There is no ISO that is “11.4” that includes updates.

You can “roll your own” with SUSE Studio, but if you are new to openSUSE
or Linux, that’s an advanced method.

> On the other hand, not having been a
> developer of openSUSE software myself and preferring to use a version of
> openSUSE which runs well, I would not want a version of openSUSE 11.4
> that would not run well or would have major problems. So would the
> development version of openSUSE 11.4 instead have been the correct
> choice for me to have made, given these criteria? If not, please
> instruct me in detail on what the classifications stable and development
> in practice mean.

“Development” means “in progress for the next release”, “beta”, “pre-
release”, etc. “Stable” means “this is what was built on the 11.4
release and went through some form of QA”.

> --Or else how could and should one best obtain from the
> Internet the kind of up-to-date version of openSUSE 11.4 that I have
> been discussing?

Again, download the ISO from opensuse.org and install updates once the
base is installed.

Jim

Jim Henderson
openSUSE Forums Administrator
Forum Use Terms & Conditions at http://tinyurl.com/openSUSE-T-C

jdmcdaniel3 · August 2, 2011, 12:31am

Hello. I think openSUSE 11.4 was expected to be publicly released on March 10, 2011; I assume it was. During April 17-18, 2011 I made an online upgrade from openSUSE 11.3 to 11.4.—That is I obtained and probably installed the needed files for that upgrade while connected to the Internet and did not obtain the needed files for that upgrade from a Recordable Digital Video Disc (DVD-R). Since April 18, 2011 I have downloaded from the Internet and installed a number of updates to openSUSE-11.4 software. But I thought it would also be good to have the installation files for openSUSE 11.4 on a DVD-R from which I could boot my computer in case in the future I might want to reinstall openSUSE 11.4 while offline and/or perhaps after updates to openSUSE-11.4 are no longer available from the Internet. I would normally prefer that that .iso (International Organization for Standardization) file to be downloaded be the latest version available of it, including updates, that still allows a 32-bit computer to run well. I think the openSUSE classifications for its .iso file seem to fall under the classifications of “stable” and “development.” In July of 2011 I downloaded the stable release by a “Direct Link” for a “32-bit” computer. Comparing the md5 check sum for the file I downloaded, it has the same md5 check sum as in the file openSUSE-11.4-i586.iso.md5 dated March 9, 2011 and obtainable on July 21-22, 2011 from Index of /opensuse/distribution/11.4/iso/. So I presume I obtained the March 2, 2011 version of the file openSUSE-11.4-DVD-i586.iso, which is also in the Web directory of the file openSUSE-11.4-DVD.i586.iso.md5.

But probably numerous updates to openSUSE-11.4 software were produced and publicly distributed between March 10, 2011 and July 21, 2011, which I would not expect to have been included in the openSUSE-11.4 .iso file dated March 9, 2011. Maybe on July 21, 2011 I should instead have obtained the development version of the openSUSE-11.4 .iso file in order for it to have included all of the updates to the .iso file for the installation of openSUSE 11.4. On the other hand, not having been a developer of openSUSE software myself and preferring to use a version of openSUSE which runs well, I would not want a version of openSUSE 11.4 that would not run well or would have major problems. So would the development version of openSUSE 11.4 instead have been the correct choice for me to have made, given these criteria? If not, please instruct me in detail on what the classifications stable and development in practice mean.–Or else how could and should one best obtain from the Internet the kind of up-to-date version of openSUSE 11.4 that I have been discussing? Thanks in advance for any teaching of me that any of you might do here.

Hello 2009Newbie. Here are a few things to understand:

Once an openSUSE version goes into final production, unless there was some sort of grievous problem, that CD/DVD copy of a fixed version of openSUSE is not updated again.
All updates for openSUSE must be obtained online and can not be found as some sort of new CD or DVD.
Update happen perhaps everyday to one or more files. You simply could never get to that final set of upgrades.
The CD or DVD released versions are designed to run without an Internet connection, though if any bugs slipped through, no updates means that there will be no fix for you.
openSUSE does not presently use a Service Pack method to distribute clumps of patches or fixes which is more common with commercial products.

We live in an internet connected world and updates come out almost as soon as they are made public. What you see is what we have.

Thank You,

2009Newbie · March 27, 2012, 5:28am

I write “Thank you” to those of you who kindly took time to post some information here. I hope no one will take what I write here as being critical. Rather please consider what I write here as possible ways things might be improved. Experts can consider how practical or impractical my ideas may be.

I have two general proposals for openSUSE developers to consider for preparing up-to-date openSUSE software to be downloaded for the making of a Digital Video Disc (DVD) from which openSUSE software could be installed onto a computer hard-disk drive:

A) The idea here is similar to custom-ordering a new car from a Michigan factory. If I remember correctly, I think that could be done in the twentieth century; I don’t know if it can still be done today. You specify the make and model of the new car you want. Then suppose you want bucket seats, leather upholstery, power windows, power brakes, etc. And you order the car to be custom-produced for you according to your specific desires, if there isn’t already a car waiting to be transported to you which meets your requirements.

Similarly imagine going to an openSUSE Web site where a server program runs to allow you to choose in a custom way the groups of software packages or software packages you want along with the basic openSUSE operating-system software. The server program imaginably then fetches the latest versions of those packages kept in a directory containing only the latest versions of the named software packages. When the order of the user is complete, he clicks on an imaginary “Download” button. The server program then makes a .iso (International Standards Organization) file containing the latest versions of the user’s requested software packages along with the basic, openSUSE, operating-system files. And the download of the .iso file to the user imaginably begins.

B) The idea here is to provide the latest versions of all of the software packages that normally are included in a .iso file for openSUSE. A server program could imaginably produce that .iso file for downloading ahead of the user’s request to download it. After downloading the .iso file and writing it onto a DVD, the user could then choose the packages or groups of them that he wants to install onto his computer’s hard-disk drive, much like late in the year 2011.

Both proposals A and B could allow up-to-date openSUSE software to be downloaded from the Internet. I think that would likely be better than the way things have been done because I suppose more problems may be fixed in the new software than new problems would be made by including the up-to-date software. I like proposal A better than B because the size of the download might be reduced using proposal A compared to proposal B (If Unicode is used to handle many foreign languages, then imaginably one file size could take care of all N human languages in which the software is available, instead of maybe about N times that file size to accommodate all N human languages without using Unicode.). Also in proposal A a user won’t be receiving programs he does not request in his own human language.–If the server programs could be made to run rapidly on high-speed computers, the corresponding reduction in the sizes of downloads could reduce Internet traffic; also Internet traffic could be reduced by not having to obtain some updates through the Internet, since the provided packages would already be up to date.–In a case in which the update simply replaces the older software package and the updated and original packages have close to the same size in bytes, the total downloading time for reaching the final goal of obtaining the up-to-date package could imaginably be roughly cut in half compared to downloading first the original package and later downloading the updated package. The reduction in especially unnecessary downloading time could benefit the user and reduce the use of the server computer in the downloading part of things.

A major disadvantage of each of my proposals is that they would necessitate more human work in programming in the preparation of the up-to-date .iso file than the procedure used in the preparation of a .iso file late in the year 2011. But after the server program has been written by one or more human beings to do both the fetching of the latest versions of the software packages and the preparing of the custom-ordered .iso file, the server program could be set to run automatically, ideally without human involvement after any errors in the server programs have been corrected. Another disadvantage I see is that especially in proposal A the server computers could in one aspect be more heavily used than in late 2011 while obtaining the user’s “order” and preparing it for him in the form of a custom .iso file. But one could hope that this additional demand on the server computer could be offset to some unknown extent by the reduction in the demand on it due to the lower downloading that I mentioned. Also in an ideal situation perhaps parallel processing could be put to use so that perhaps the same server computer could be receiving somebody’s “order” of desired software packages while operating in the next step of preparing the custom .iso file from the list of software packages already selected by someone else.–But actually I don’t know for sure whether those two processes could be made to run that exclusively or not. It would be up to the expert developers to add the details to one of these two general procedures A or B in order to make it work.

hendersj · March 27, 2012, 7:34am

On Tue, 27 Mar 2012 03:36:02 +0000, 2009Newbie wrote:

> I have two general proposals for openSUSE developers to consider for
> preparing up-to-date openSUSE software to be downloaded for the making
> of a Digital Video Disc (DVD) from which openSUSE software could be
> installed onto a computer hard-disk drive:

Be aware that in general, the developers do not read the forums, so if
you want to submit an enhancement request, you should do so through the
FATE feature request system.

> A) The idea here is similar to custom-ordering a new car from a Michigan
> factory. If I remember correctly, I think that could be done in the
> twentieth century; I don’t know if it can still be done today. You
> specify the make and model of the new car you want. Then suppose you
> want bucket seats, leather upholstery, power windows, power brakes, etc.
> And you order the car to be custom-produced for you according to your
> specific desires, if there isn’t already a car waiting to be transported
> to you which meets your requirements.

http://www.susestudio.com does pretty much this exact thing.

In general, though, you won’t see updates released on official openSUSE
ISO images because of the amount of regression testing that has to take
place in order to ensure that things work together. If they didn’t do
that. Official media that has updated programs probably isn’t going to
happen because of the amount of work that has to be done to ensure things
work together smoothly. Stability is one of the key features of openSUSE,
which means sometimes updates have to wait for the next release. Some
things, like security patches, are backported from future kernels, but
for example, 12.1 won’t get a 3.3 kernel because what shipped is a 3.1
kernel, and keeping a stable ABI (amongst other things) is important to
compatibility with the number of packages included.

Jim

–
Jim Henderson
openSUSE Forums Administrator
Forum Use Terms & Conditions at http://tinyurl.com/openSUSE-T-C

2009Newbie · March 27, 2012, 7:59am

Thanks, Jim Henderson, for kindly teaching me something here. Is SUSE Studio software provided free of charge?

tsu2 · March 27, 2012, 5:10pm

You might consider no matter what install media you choose including the DVD, if during the installation you select online sourcesmany updated packages will be installed in place of the older original packages. After the Install is completed you should still do an update immediately to get the few remaining latest.

Regardless whether you use online sources or not the DVD is still good for recovery if no network connection is available.

HTH,
TS

robin_listas · March 27, 2012, 8:58pm

On 2012-03-27 17:16, tsu2 wrote:
> You might consider no matter what install media you choose including the
> DVD, if during the installation you select online sourcesmany updated
> packages will be installed in place of the older original packages.

Me, I prefer to install only from the CD/DVD, without updates. Get the
system ready as soon as possible. I have two reasons for this: once the
network failed and the installation crashed. I had to redo it all. Two, m
network is slow. I prefer to boot the installed system, and launch the
update: I can do things on the computer while the update runs, whereas if I
do it during installation I have to sit and look doing nothing.

I think that some people do package the updates as a DVD that can be used
to make the updates without network. There is one that does it for the
multimedia things from packman - yes, there are people without internet
access. But I don’t remember the links for these.

–
Cheers / Saludos,

Carlos E. R.
(from 11.4 x86_64 “Celadon” at Telcontar)

hendersj · March 27, 2012, 9:26pm

On Tue, 27 Mar 2012 06:06:03 +0000, 2009Newbie wrote:

> Thanks, Jim Henderson, for kindly teaching me something here. Is SUSE
> Studio software provided free of charge?

Yes, access to SUSE Studio is at no charge.

Visit the website and you’ll see what flexibility it gives you.

Jim

–
Jim Henderson
openSUSE Forums Administrator
Forum Use Terms & Conditions at http://tinyurl.com/openSUSE-T-C