Is it safe to upgrade from 11.4 straight to 12.2 or should I progressively upgrade from 11.4 to 12.1 then 12.2?
I think I would like to suggest you do a clean install using the openSUSE DVD. The basic problem with a new install is that openSUSE does not want to over write anything that is existing. But, if you reuse all of your old partitions, you can do a clean install, but you do not format your /home partition. Doing a clean install with an existing home will preserve all of your personnel settings but will start afresh with all system applications and settings, those are the most likely to give you problems after an upgrade, particularly from two versions down. What I do, before I do any install, is to go into YaST / System / Partitioner, open up all partitions and do a screen capture of my existing system and print it out or at least make notes of what I had before. Do not assume you can remember the exact details. Imagine then, on a new install, you select a Custom Partition, not based on anything used before. Then, in the custom edit, you edit and mount all existing partitions, with the same location and name as before. Your SWAP will be mounted properly as before and no need to do anything different to it. On your /home, elect to edit it, select /home for its mount point and do not format it. For your root / partition, again select the very same partition, call it / again, but DO ALLOW it to be Formatted, but it will be the only partition that shows an F (for format) in the entire list of partitions when done. In the booting section I would elect to load the Grub 2 bootloader into the MBR unless you know for a fact the MBR already contains generic boot code in which case you can allow Grub to be loaded into the root / partition.
Once the installation is complete and on my second restart, I would do the following update procedure:
To fully upgrade, I would do the following tasks for openSUSE 12.2 using KDE:
- Go to YaST (Enter Root Password) / Software / Software Repository and specify the URL addition of the Packman Repository “http://packman.inode.at/suse/openSUSE_12.2/” excluding the quotes if not already done.
- Go to YaST (Enter Root Password) / Software / Software Management and select Options and check Allow Vendor Change.
- Again, still in Software Management select Package / All Packages / Update if newer version available and press the Accept button on the bottom right.
Next you normally would reboot your PC and then reload all applications that you used to have before. It does matter if you were using a proprietary video driver before as you may need to load it again and other things, but that is getting ahead of ourselves.
Thank You,
Thanks James. I appreciate your advice.
You are welcome. I would create that 12.2 DVD boot disk and make sure it works. Make that print out of your existing partition setup. You can even do a mock install, but abort before you allow the installation to proceed. Come back and ask any questions you like. Until you let the install proceed, you can just pull the DVD and reboot your PC. If you do start the install, always allow it to complete before you do anything else. Good luck in what ever you decide to do.
Thank You,
On 2012-10-21 22:16, atpmel wrote:
>
> Is it safe to upgrade from 11.4 straight to 12.2 or should I
> progressively upgrade from 11.4 to 12.1 then 12.2?
No upgrade, nor install, is ever completely safe. >:-)
Can I do that upgrade? Of course you can, but take precautions in case
it fails.
Online upgrade
method
Offline upgrade
method
I recommend the offline method if you intend to jump over a version. If
you want to do an online upgrade, do one version at a time.
–
Cheers / Saludos,
Carlos E. R.
(from 12.1 x86_64 “Asparagus” at Telcontar)
Yes, you can do it, but…
My desktop has been running 11.4 since it was released - I believe it was a complete re-install in a new / partition, preserving /home & /srv. Now, with the upcoming EOL of 11.4, I had planned to do the same with 12.2. After I got going, though, I decided I’d try an update so I wouldn’t have to re-install any 3rd party (Google Earth, Moneydance, LightScribe, etc) or special repo (Tesseract, gOCR, fonts) stuff it had; then it turned into a challenge and a bit of fun. So here are some of my notes…
Prep work:
- Backup everything you care about
- Run Online Update
- Inventory what you are running - here’s my system before:
System: Host: cloyd Kernel: 2.6.37.6-0.20-desktop x86_64 (64 bit)
Desktop KDE 4.6.5 Distro: openSUSE 11.4 (x86_64) VERSION = 11.4 CODENAME = Celadon
Machine: Mobo: ASUSTeK model: P6T version: Rev 1.xx Bios: American Megatrends version: 0202 date: 12/04/2008
CPU: Quad core Intel Core i7 CPU 920 (-HT-MCP-) cache: 8192 KB flags: (lm nx sse sse2 sse3 sse4_1 sse4_2 ssse3 vmx)
Clock Speeds: 1: 1600.00 MHz 2: 1600.00 MHz 3: 1600.00 MHz 4: 1600.00 MHz 5: 1600.00 MHz 6: 1600.00 MHz 7: 1600.00 MHz 8: 1600.00 MHz
Graphics: Card: nVidia Device 0f00 X.Org: 1.9.3 driver: nvidia Resolution: 1680x1050@60.0hz, 1920x1080@60.0hz
GLX Renderer: GeForce GT 630/PCIe/SSE2 GLX Version: 4.2.0 NVIDIA 304.43
Audio: Card-1: Intel 82801JI (ICH10 Family) HD Audio Controller driver: HDA Intel Sound: ALSA ver: 1.0.23
Card-2: nVidia GF108 High Definition Audio Controller driver: HDA Intel
Card-3: Logitech driver: USB Audio
Network: Card: Realtek RTL8111/8168B PCI Express Gigabit Ethernet controller driver: r8169
IF: eth0 mstate: up speed: 100 Mbps duplex: full mac: 00:24:8c:38:66:57
Drives: HDD Total Size: 2000.4GB (3.4% used) 1: /dev/sda ST31000333AS 1000.2GB
2: /dev/sdd ST31000333AS 1000.2GB
Partition: ID: / size: 20G used: 8.6G (46%) fs: rootfs ID: / size: 20G used: 8.6G (46%) fs: ext4
ID: /home size: 917G used: 56G (7%) fs: ext3 ID: swap-1 size: 2.15GB used: 0.00GB (0%) fs: swap
Sensors: System Temperatures: cpu: 35.0C mobo: 37.0C gpu: 37C
Fan Speeds (in rpm): cpu: 948 psu: 715 sys-1: 1180 sys-2: 0
Info: Processes: 199 Uptime: 16 days 23:26 Memory: 898.0/5971.9MB Client: Shell inxi: 1.7.24
- Print copies of /etc/fstab and /boot/grub/menu.lst (I forgot to do menu.lst and regretted it
) - Verify the media - I had planned to boot from a USB stick, as I did on my laptop, but found out the BIOS in the desktop didn’t support it. Back to 11.4 to burn(and verify) a DVD.
- Make sure your backups are current.
- If you have a custom xorg.conf you should probably move it to a safe place, out of /etc/X11. After the update you can put it back, or re-create it. (Another thing I forgot)
- Did I mention backups?
You should be ready to update. Pop in the DVD, boot it, and select update. I did have some weird displays during the initial boot, but they straightened out by the first dialog. Make sure you aim the update at the correct root partition if you have more than one. Let the update start and take a break (the time remaining displayed is very bogus, but my update took about 35 minutes.)
Next the system will reboot - this is where the fun started. The reboot failed with Err: 22 partition not found. After a while and a few boots into rescue mode, I found it was trying to boot from the disc containing /home. (Would have been apparent if I had an orginal menu.lst to compare to.) After some problems with grub’s editing facility, I changed all (HD0,5) to (HD1,5) and it booted. The display had some problems, since it had an xorg.conf that expected the nVidia driver around - moved that and display OK.
Logged in as my normal userid, and KDE started its ‘resource migration’ - let it finish. Fired up YAST, ran online update, had one conflict - resolved (but I forgot to note how). Then I added the nVidia repo, ran Software Management, driver already selected, and installed. Reboot and perfect video.
After this reboot, I let apper run - it updated 101 packages. Ran SW MGMT again, and updated the blue packages (mostly -32bit and Non-OSS.) Added Packman repo and updated those packages.
Then I did a little housecleaning - ran SWMGMT and deleted a lot of red entries - packages that were renamed or otherwise no longer needed, but without RPM info to delete them automagically. One gotcha was that LibreOffice had its own link to OpenJDK 1.6, so it needed to be reconfigured.
The only real user hassle was the KDE 4.6.5 -> 4.8.4 change. I had to refer to some old forum posts to update the resource entries pointing to the calendar and email locations.
So at the cost of a rainy Saturday, I have my desktop up on the latest-and-greatest, and I have >18 months before I have to do it again.
Thanks for the info jdmcdaniel3 - that’s incredibly helpful! I hope you don’t mind if I chip in with a very naive question.
I have had very positive experiences with the openSUSE DVD updates (e.g. 11.2->11.3->11.4, and 12.1->12.2) rather than wholesale reinstall (+/- preserving the /home/ partition). The only time I recall a problem recently was attempting the 11.4->12.1 transition. So my question is does this mean upgrades are probably fine between minor version updates whereas reinstalls are recommended for major version updates? Told you it was naive question!
I suppose the best thing to do is to back up your data and give the upgrading route a try fist. If that works out fine great - if not do a fresh install of 12.2 and copy your data back.
First off, I don’t want to put words into our developers mouths, so here is what they on the subject: SDB:System upgrade - openSUSE
Now it is my opinion only, that a single version upgrade is the most likely to succeed. Trouble issues can occur like when openSUSE 12.1 switched to systemd or while openSUSE 12.2 switched to Grub 2, both are major changes and a double whammy if going from 11.4 to 12.2. So I suggest to always do a new install, remounting all of your old partitions and to only format the root / one. Its true you lose your global system settings, but you preserve all of your personnel ones. And, any major changes like grub 2 or systemd are going to be handled properly for you. In the end, the best you can do is take the alleged advice from the people that should know and make your best guess as to the action you need to take with your openSUSE system. And in all cases, good luck in what ever you decide to do.
Thank You,
On 2012-10-23 21:36, flymail wrote:
>
> Thanks for the info jdmcdaniel3 - that’s incredibly helpful! I hope you
> don’t mind if I chip in with a very naive question.
>
>
> So my question is
> does this mean upgrades are probably fine between minor version updates
> whereas reinstalls are recommended for major version updates? Told you
> it was naive question!
Had you read the documentation, you would know 
A zypper dup across more than one version is not supported.
A dvd upgrade in that case is possible, but dangers and difficulties
increase the longer the jump.
Besides, in openSUSE there are no major / minor versions.
–
Cheers / Saludos,
Carlos E. R.
(from 12.1 x86_64 “Asparagus” at Telcontar)
Carlos - you’re going to have to show me in the documentation where it explicitly states when a DVD installation is required rather than a DVD upgrade because I cannot find it.
Thanks for the info an link. I found the information in SDB:Offline upgrade - openSUSE useful. It says:
However, there are other data files that are not kept, like mysql databases, imap email storage, system configurations, like for postfix, samba, or hylafax, server files like apache web files, that make an upgrade more interesting and can actually save time on some scenarios. A server machine can take weeks to configure.
But then it also says:
Why do a system upgrade instead of a fresh install? Proponents of the fresh install route say that there will be stale system libraries, broken configurations, etc, that you don’t get with a fresh install. Most of the data files are stored on ‘/home’, which if not formatted are kept with a fresh install. And it is usually faster and less problematic.
… which seems to serve essentially as a disclaimer i.e. you can do it, but don’t be surprised if you have a broken configuration. I think the best solution it recommends is:
A trick is to also install fresh on a small partition, in order to test the target distribution on the target hardware; thus problems can be checked and solved before the actual upgrade, and later some configurations can be compared. Besides, it makes for a nice rescue system. Or, if possible, you can test here the factory version, and later upgrade the main partition. Many possibilities!
Neat idea :).
On 10/24/2012 11:36 AM, flymail wrote:
> Carlos - you’re going to have to show me in the documentation where it
> explicitly states when a DVD installation is required rather than a DVD
> upgrade because I cannot find it. . . . I found the information in ‘SDB:Offline
> upgrade - openSUSE’ (http://en.opensuse.org/SDB:Offline_upgrade) useful.
> It says:<snip>
so, all you need to know is that Carlos wrote that offline upgrade for
the Support Data Base and is probably the most knowledgeable individual
on the upgrade subject in this forum…
not to say that he can’t make mistakes–but, if he tells you something
that you don’t want to believe until you see it in “the documentation”
don’t be surprised if he rewrites the documentation as needed to make it
infinitely clear in which way to go…
ymmv
and, by the way: Carlos and i have the same last name, and while we are
not brothers we are both very good looking!
–
dd
In which case thank you very much Carlos :).
On 2012-10-24 12:16, flymail wrote:
>
>
>
> In which case thank you very much Carlos :).
Welcome you both.
I should note that I’m not a developer, so don’t take that documentation
as the ultimate word (and I guess the same goes for the online upgrade
method). Devs seldom write docs (same here as in Windows as in
everywhere, I guess), which is unfortunate. And when they do, it often
is unreadable! X’-)
There are scenarios I have no first hand experience. For instance,
upgrading to 12.2 often breaks raid systems, if you read the posts here
and elsewhere - and I don’t know why or how to avoid.
(I should find time and finish that wiki page)
–
Cheers / Saludos,
Carlos E. R.
(from 12.1 x86_64 “Asparagus” at Telcontar)
Hello.
I came across this thread when searching for info about the same process.
Please keep in mind that not all of us rely on OpenSUSE for desktop use. I am using OpenSUSE for multiple servers in my company and I have tried all kinds of migrations in the past between different versions. The last thing I am interested in, is keeping my user preferences intact in the home partition. In fact it’s the fist I decide to format at any installation over existing system. What I am interested is mostly keeping my applications working, some originating from distribution packages, some compiled from sources.
DVD upgrade has failed many times in versions prior to 11.x. The last attempt I did was trying to get from 10.3 version (if I remember correctly) to a 11.4 system, going one minor version at a time. The last dvd upgrade failed miserably (from 11.3 to 11.4) so I had to do a fresh install and rebuild everything from backups.
The real problem with server upgrades is that you must try to minimize services downtime. So the options you have are:
- do a side by side install with a different system, transfer all configuration data offline, stop production services, transfer production data over to new system, bring up the services.
- do a dvd upgrade, accepting that services will be down for a considerably longer period
- do an inplace upgrade (zypper dup).
I believe the last one is the best if you are starting from a version from 11.4 and after.
I don’t know if it is possible to do that one minor version at a time, but I suppose it is if you have the correct locations for the repositories that you have to add each time you prepare for the upgrade. Personally, if it is possible, I would prefer skipping any bugs that the versions in between may induce.
I do intend to try a zypper dup upgrade from 11.4 to 12.2 in an hour. It’s a vmware based system so I will do this after taking a snapshot (revert to snapshot is magic for those cases). I will update with feedback.
On 2013-01-23 13:26, mythryll wrote:
Another method is having two installs in the same computer, one the
current system, and you install the next fresh on another partition. It
is the poor man alternative to two computers.
> DVD upgrade has failed many times in versions prior to 11.x. The last
> attempt I did was trying to get from 10.3 version (if I remember
> correctly) to a 11.4 system, going one minor version at a time. The last
> dvd upgrade failed miserably (from 11.3 to 11.4) so I had to do a fresh
> install and rebuild everything from backups.
And you don’t know why, what exactly failed?
When a dvd upgrade failed to me I usually learned why, so that I could
restore from backup and try again. And it happens very seldom to me, so
I’m interested in knowing what failed.
> - do an inplace upgrade (zypper dup).
> I believe the last one is the best if you are starting from a version
> from 11.4 and after.
I personally do not like it. There are dangers with replacing programs
and libraries while they are being used.
> I don’t know if it is possible to do that one minor version at a time,
> but I suppose it is if you have the correct locations for the
> repositories that you have to add each time you prepare for the upgrade.
Notice that doing a dup may replace things from a particular repo with
the same from a different repo.
> Personally, if it is possible, I would prefer skipping any bugs that the
> versions in between may induce.
Obviously, but not much choice there.
> I do intend to try a zypper dup upgrade from 11.4 to 12.2 in an hour.
A jump over versions with dup is not supported, you have to go through
all versions. It might work, though.
(the devs have tried the dup during factory creation, from the previous
version to factory. If a program or library is replaced live and things
fail, they notice and correct. But this is done only for that particular
upgrade, from one version to the next. Two version jump is untested).
> It’s a vmware based system so I will do this after taking a snapshot
> (revert to snapshot is magic for those cases). I will update with
> feedback.
Yes, a snapshot is a wonderful thing to have.
–
Cheers / Saludos,
Carlos E. R.
(from 11.4, with Evergreen, x86_64 “Celadon” (Minas Tirith))
Hello Carlos, nice to see you are keeping up with the thread after 3 months 
I have searched the document describing the procedure for zypper (this one) but there is nothing I found saying that you can’t jump minor versions. The upgrade is ongoing and I didn’t receive a warning about that (maybe no warning was included for it).
I agree about the poor man install but when dealing with servers (physical or virtual) and reduced downtime, dealing with partition manipulation is not what I like spending time with… I usually prefer using older physical systems or virtual machines I can erase later. But like you said, if you don’t pay for servers yourself it’s different and workstation disks cost a lot less.
For the failed upgrade it’s been a while so I can’t tell you exactly what it was. I remember multiple failures in upgrading packets but not exactly what it was. It could have been anything really, it’s a lot less interactive when you do a dvd upgrade. Or it was back then anyway. It had already taken me some time to get to 11.3 from 10.3, as I had to stop after each upgrade and let the system work for a few days. So when it failed, I didn’t had the courage to go back there again. I just wanted a method that worked for me. Using opensource in an enterprise not officialy supporting it can be difficult.
About the files and libraries used, you get a list in the end with what was in use during the upgrade, advising a restart for those programs and services. I never saw a failure or problem with it though, I believe they do get replaced.
When version 12.2 came out, there was a problem with hardware check during a fresh install and after first boot for older machines. I believe it’s about the video driver not supporting certain hardware (it’s a known bug) so I ended up not being able to do fresh installs for two physical machines that were working fine with earlier versions, I could not even pass options during boot to use the vesa driver (this is the only remedy so you can boot the system after install). So I had to install 12.1 and do zypper dup to 12.2. I can tell you that those two systems seem to work better than my fresh 12.2 installs on virtual hardware.
I do understand the plus for doing a fresh install, you end up with a system as the manufacturer intended it to work, even if there are bugs that come with it, at least it’s the same bugs that all end up with. But sometimes the in-place upgrade seems like a better choice.
Thanks for the response, I will update the thread when I get more feedback, right now I got a 3.1 Gb download in process and have to wait for the result. But at least my services are up!
Yannis.
On 01/23/2013 01:26 PM, mythryll wrote:
> I am using OpenSUSE for multiple servers in my company
if all your apps are smiling in 11.4 why leave it? just move from
openSUSE 11.4 to openSUSE 11.4 Evergreen, it is fully supported with
security patches until July 2014, read/follow the simple instructions
here http://tinyurl.com/4aflkpy
its just add one repo and update, fini. (i’m running 11.4E as my daily
driver, sweet!)
–
dd
openSUSE®, the “German Engineered Automobile” of operating systems!
http://tinyurl.com/DD-Caveat
http://tinyurl.com/DD-Software
On 2013-01-23 15:46, mythryll wrote:
>
> Hello Carlos, nice to see you are keeping up with the thread after 3
> months
It is easy for me using nntp and thunderbird.
> I have searched the document describing the procedure for zypper (‘this
> one’ (http://en.opensuse.org/SDB:System_upgrade)) but there is nothing I
> found saying that you can’t jump minor versions.
Notice that there are no minor versions in openSUSE, that’s a common
misconceptions. There are only full versions, regardless what the
numbering might suggest.
> The upgrade is ongoing
> and I didn’t receive a warning about that (maybe no warning was included
> for it).
No, the warning is not coded. Zypper is not aware of the version.
> For the failed upgrade it’s been a while so I can’t tell you exactly
> what it was. I remember multiple failures in upgrading packets but not
> exactly what it was. It could have been anything really, it’s a lot less
> interactive when you do a dvd upgrade. Or it was back then anyway. It
> had already taken me some time to get to 11.3 from 10.3, as I had to
> stop after each upgrade and let the system work for a few days. So when
> it failed, I didn’t ha d the courage to go back there again. I just
> wanted a method that worked for me. Using opensource in an enterprise
> not officialy supporting it can be difficult.
I understand…
> About the files and libraries used, you get a list in the end with what
> was in use during the upgrade, advising a restart for those programs and
> services. I never saw a failure or problem with it though, I believe
> they do get replaced.
If you watch the factory list you see those problems been ironed. Like
when rpm changed the method use to package the rpms…
> I do understand the plus for doing a fresh install, you end up with a
> system as the manufacturer intended it to work, even if there are bugs
> that come with it, at least it’s the same bugs that all end up with. But
> sometimes the in-place upgrade seems like a better choice.
I always upgrade my few systems via dvd
> Thanks for the response, I will update the thread when I get more
> feedback, right now I got a 3.1 Gb download in process and have to wait
> for the result. But at least my services are up!
> Yannis.
Ok
I’m to start a move, so I might miss some posts.
–
Cheers / Saludos,
Carlos E. R.
(from 11.4, with Evergreen, x86_64 “Celadon” (Minas Tirith))
Ok here is the verdict…
The online upgrade finished but there were some alarming messages along the way. It did quite a few corrections for file and dir permissions (which I suppose are a good thing) but on certain cases there were some like this “… Aborting …” when some files or dirs were not in the right place. Of course the system was working the whole time and I even got expected error messages when my perl snmp libraries (the one mrtg uses) where replaced, as would happen in a fresh install. But could I trust the system in the long run? I guess not.
So my conclusion is this: People are right to want a fresh start, so when possible follow that advice (new install with home partition intact as described earlier by Carlos and others). In fact if it is possible I would go even further with the risk of being judged insane, format the home partition too and restore only necessary data (or edit and insert the old ones) from backups.
However, if it is not possible and you want to minimize downtime, an online upgrade is possible but not recommended (sounds like an advice in a movie…). Perhaps going through all the versions one by one would have been smoother.
What did I do? While the online upgrade was on going (after seeing those messages) I started setting up a new system, which I left at the point of hostname and domain configuration. After the inplace upgrade was completed, I backed up all the recent data, renamed my old system and changed ip address, went ahead with the new system configuration using the old hostname and ip address, installed missing packages, restored data, and put up the services. I did have the cost of service downtime for quite a while, but it was during night time.
After copying some user data over to the new system, my old system will be erased. Thank you for the advice, I didn’t know about Evergreen, maybe if I did my course would have been different.
Now I just have to find out why kde updates don’t work on 12.2 (there is a bug report on kde support but it’s an old one, still no solution https://bugs.kde.org/show_bug.cgi?id=228597). But that’s another story (and on a different forum .
Yannis