I got a new computer at work today, and I am planning to install 13.1 when it gets released, and use its long term support. However the release date for 13.1 is in two weeks, and I need to have a functional computer as soon as possible (in a day or two).
So, since I am definately moving to 13.1 when it gets out, my question is what should I install today? Should I install 12.3 and do a new installation of 13.1 in two weeks (which includes reinstalling all apps and setting up a few things) or is it preferable to install 13.1RC2 and do a system upgrade for 13.1?
I have read that when the major version changes (ie 12 to 13) a new install is better. I have no idea however of the result of a system upgrade from an RC version to GA. Is it smoother/safer etc? I would like to hear your opinions on this.
No, that’s not true for openSUSE.
Upgrading from 12.3 to 13.1 isn’t any different than upgrading from 12.2 to 12.3 f.e. The upgrade from one version to the next is always a supported scenario. If you skip versions, f.e. upgrade 12.1 to 12.3, you should expect problems though, although it might work fine as well.
The version number doesn’t really say anything about the changes. The releases are just numbered that way: 12.1, 12.2, 12.3, 13.1, 13.2, 13.3, 14.1, …
That said, in your case I would go for 13.1RC2. It is nearly ready.
And you don’t have to do anything special to upgrade to 13.1 final when it is released. You will get the changed packages via standard online updates.
Btw. although the official release is in 2 weeks as you write, the GM will be available on Nov. 9th already. That’s the final 13.1 version. After that there won’t be any changes anymore.
And until then, also only critical bugs are fixed. So you won’t have to expect big changes anymore.
Well, in this case it’s not really an upgrade, since there won’t be any big changes anymore and even the repo URLs won’t change.
Just install the normal updates via “zypper up” or the updater applet and you’ll get to 13.1 GM automatically.
> Well, in this case it’s not really an upgrade, since there won’t be any
> big changes anymore and even the repo URLs won’t change.
> Just install the normal updates via “zypper up” or the updater applet
> and you’ll get to 13.1 GM automatically.
You can not be sure of that. If there is a single package that needs to
be removed, or that goes down one number in release, it will not happen.
The recommended method by the devs is “zypper dup”, same as for
“tumbleweed”.
Maybe nothing like that happens, and a “zypper up” works fine; but you
can not be absolutely sure.
–
Cheers / Saludos,
Carlos E. R.
(from 12.3 x86_64 “Dartmouth” at Telcontar)
That’s not going to happen anymore. Remember, GM is on the coming Friday.
Only critical bugfixes are still allowed to go in, the rest will appear as update in the update repo anyway.
The recommended method by the devs is “zypper dup”, same as for
“tumbleweed”.
Where have you read that?
Maybe nothing like that happens, and a “zypper up” works fine; but you
can not be absolutely sure.
Yes you can, by knowing how OBS works. The build numbers won’t go down, only up.
Thanks a lot for the help! I am going to install 13.1RC2 today.
The upgrade from one version to the next is always a supported scenario
That’s what I had in mind originally, but I think I remember reading in these forums that sometimes big changes occur (for example some system files might get placed in different paths for some reason, and thus a new install is recommended). Anyways, I probably got something wrong, thanks for making things clear :).
As far as the “zypper dup” (with the “from” argument) is concerned, I somehow had the impression that this command is the same as performing a “Switch system packages” from YaST. So if I am using the repos from 13.1RC2 (and say only those), what would a zypper dup be useful for? I guess “zypper dup” (without any arguments) is different, but I think this is a conversation for a different thread.
I am probably keeping it to “zypper up” and “zypper patch” when the 13.1 time comes, although I am going to check what “zypper dup” would intent to do. I am using (including the rest of my machines) the original repos, KDE Release (of the latest version) and Extra, and a few more community ones (mainly virtualization), all from Index of /repositories, and packman from the multimedia guide. I hope they are combatible enough.
Thanks for helping me deciding, I really appreciate it!
I try to answer that in short:
“zypper dup” is mainly intended for upgrading from one openSUSE version to the other (dup = distribution upgrade). The main difference between “dup” and “up” is that “dup” treats all repositories equal and installs the highest package versions it finds (there’s also repo priorities, but let’s forget about that detail now). It also downgrades packages, if only lower versions than the one installed are available. “up” on the other hand has a concept of “vendor-stickiness”, i.e. it doesn’t switch a package to a version from another repository unless explicitely told to do so. And it only installs packages if they have a higher version than already installed.
The “–from” option (“up” does accept this as well) tells zypper to restrict the operation to only the specified repositories. So yes, “zypper dup --from repo” is the same as “Switch system packages” from YaST. But you can specify more than one repo after the “–from”.
With only the 4 standard repos (oss, non-oss, oss-update, non-oss-update), the result of “dup” and “up” should be the same, since all packages are from the same vendor and the version numbers should only increase, not decrease (well, oss and non-oss will be frozen anyway after the GM on Friday). Except if you already installed packages from other sources. “dup” would switch them back to a version from those repos if available, whereas “up” wouldn’t.
I am using (including the rest of my machines) the original repos, KDE Release (of the latest version) and Extra, and a few more community ones (mainly virtualization), all from Index of /repositories, and packman from the multimedia guide. I hope they are combatible enough.
Just one note:
You don’t really need the KDE:Release:411 repo for 13.1, since the 4.11.x updates will be delivered through the standard update channel. (only a little bit later though)
One thing to add, which I forgot about: Actually you can also select more than 1 repo in YaST and do “Switch system packages”…
You might want to add the KDE:Release:412 repo though and upgrade to 4.12 when it is released on Dec. 18th. But there’s also a 4.11.5 planned to be released on Jan. 7th…
>> The recommended method by the devs is “zypper dup”, same as for
>> “tumbleweed”.
> Where have you read that?
Factory mail list. Ask them (devs, not users). Coolo or equivalent.
>> Maybe nothing like that happens, and a “zypper up” works fine; but you
>> can not be absolutely sure.
>>
> Yes you can, by knowing how OBS works. The build numbers won’t go down,
> only up.
Not true. RC1 had one package going down a number. I did not write it
down, but there was such an occurrence. I did a zypper patch, then
zypper update, then a zypper dup - several packages changed, one went
down. Took me by surprise, I thought that would never happen inside RC1
(ie, update from RC1 to RC1)
–
Cheers / Saludos,
Carlos E. R.
(from 12.3 x86_64 “Dartmouth” at Telcontar)
this is is very handy and I will follow it religiously come the time.
I read the instructions and have only one question.
They said to have my present version fully up to date.
I have been checking daily in Yast for online updates, but there are still updates that I get notices for, which don’t appear in Yast as critical.
Should I worry about them and get them updated somehow ?
The reason for this is that when the 4.11 Release Schedule was decided, KDE still had a 6 months release cycle. So 4.12 would have been released at the end of January/the beginning of February. Therefore a 4.11.5 was scheduled for January 7th.
When the planning for the 4.12 release was done, it was decided to shorten the release cycle to 5 months so the time to wait for getting new features in is shorter (kde-workspace is feature-frozen now anyway, so there’s no need for a longer testing period). Therefore 4.12 will come out in December instead.
But since a 4.11.5 release was already announced for January, it was decided to stick to releasing that as well, although it comes after 4.12.
This is of course a positive thing for openSUSE 13.1 users, since only the 4.11.x bug fix releases will be provided via the normal update repo. So they do get an additional 4.11.5 bugfix update in January without having to add any additional KDE repo.
You are on 13.1RC2 now?
There won’t be any updates until Friday, when 13.1 is GM.
And where in YaST are you checking?
You won’t get all the updated packages with YaST->Online Update, because they are no online updates/patches in the technical sense.
You would have to run “zypper dup”, “zypper up”, or YaST->Software Management (“View”->“Repositories”, right-click on the package list and select “All in this list”->“Update if newer version is available”).
>
> this is is very handy and I will follow it religiously come the time.
> I read the instructions and have only one question.
> They said to have my present version fully up to date.
> I have been checking daily in Yast for online updates, but there are
> still updates that I get notices for, which don’t appear in Yast as
> critical.
> Should I worry about them and get them updated somehow ?
That recommendation really applies when going from, say, 12.3 to 13.1,
not from RC to RC. Those upgrades are important, thousands of packages
to upgrade, some big changes, and have to be done with care and
precautions. They are dangerous, in fact.
The recommendation is to have only the “official” repos active: oss,
non-oss, updates, non-oss-updates. In that situation, after running yast
online update (or zypper patch, which is equivalent), there will not be
any more updates left; ie, apper will not find anything else to update -
because all official updates come only via the two update repos.
Again, this for a full distribution upgrade, not for the RCs, nor for RC
to GM, because the jump, if any, will be very small.
–
Cheers / Saludos,
Carlos E. R.
(from 12.3 x86_64 “Dartmouth” at Telcontar)
On 2013-11-06 08:16, wolfi323 wrote:
> I was not talking about the Milestones or RC1, I was talking about
> now, i.e. RC2 with only 3 days left until GM.
I know. I still recommend using “dup”. Or at least trying after “up” to
see if there is a difference.
–
Cheers / Saludos,
Carlos E. R.
(from 12.3 x86_64 “Dartmouth” at Telcontar)
No, I am on 12.3 but planning on making the leap when it’s available.
Apper is the other update app I was thinking about.
Apper pops up a notification whenever a new update is available. At that time I go to Yast and do the “online update” which is set to look for “needed patches”.
This morning there was 1, openssl: disable compression.
My point was that, many times apper tells me an update is available but it will not show in the needed patches in Yast.
So, there are things apper wants to update that Yast says are not so important.
My question re the “make sure your system has the latest update” had to do with the above type of discrepancies between apper and Yast.
