The age old question zypper dup vs KDE update applet in Tumbleweed

So I’m running Tumbleweed with KDE/Plasma and for the longest time I saw a note in the KDE update applet to “run zypper dup”. It’s been a while since I’ve actually opened up the applet, but I’ve poked at it today and notice the update button is back. Has it been patched to do a zypper dup behind the scenes? (like suggested here: https://www.reddit.com/r/openSUSE/comments/cyrayj/updates_on_tumbleweed_though_applet_or_packagekit/eyu0c0q/ ) I haven’t been able to find any other mention/reference to this… but my search skills may be somewhat lacking.

Yes. .

Where is the announcement? I haven’t been able to dig it up yet from the Factory mailing list or find any mention of it outside of a vague Reddit posting.

If it has been patched, then the docs need to be updated… like here: https://en.opensuse.org/Portal:Tumbleweed and https://en.opensuse.org/SDB:Upgrade_Tumbleweed because they say nothing at all about this… all instructions clearly state zypper dup only. I don’t want to wade in and update the wiki without background knowledge of what happened and when it was patched.

[opensuse-factory] Packagekit updates on Tumbleweed - openSUSE Factory - openSUSE Mailing Lists

It was only enabled in Plasma’s update applet (plasma5-pk-updates) a while later on because it didn’t support license agreements.
That’s been fixed a while ago too though:

  • Mon Aug 26 2019 Fabian Vogt <fabian@ritter-vogt.de>
  • Implement EULA handling (boo#1148168):
    • 0001-Add-support-for-license-prompts.patch
  • Enable install updates functionality on Tumbleweed again (boo#1030829):
    • Drop 0001-Hide-option-to-install-updates-on-Tumbleweed.patch

Since then, it should be safe to use the applet on Tumbleweed too (before it wasn’t even possible)
Unless there are bugs of course, which should be reported. :wink:

Wow, that’s nice to know. I’ve been telling people not to use it, as have loads of others on non openSUSE-specific forums and on Reddit etc.

So… now the task is to let people know that it can be used again.

Hi
Because it’s still zypper dup, AFAIK the applets can still be unreliable/experimental(?). This would also be desktop dependent and would probably need to ask upstream if it’s supported.

Right… I’m looking at things through a KDE lens.

Hmm still would be useful to have this made apparent somewhere so that goofs like myself start using it, and stop telling people “never click that or you break all the things”.

Anyway, thanks for the info - its really helpful!

Hi
I would suggest some caution, sure use it on your own system, but suggestions to folks it’s ok to use may have some fallout if it goes foobar :wink: Note, the bug report is against packagekit (GNOME not Plasma/KDE(?)) and if you read the final comment there is no actual confirmation it’s fixed, just if you hit a bug to file an new bug report…

I use zypper -vvv dup it will provide far more information about what is going to happen and happening :wink:

PackageKit is cross-platform, it just happens to be maintained by the GNOME team in (open)SUSE.

KDE’s update applet is just a frontend to PackageKit.
Discover uses PackageKit as well btw, so should also be safe to use for updating your system meanwhile.

But not YaST2 -> Software Management, correct? Warning in Portal:Tumbleweed, “When updating Tumbleweed, always use the dist-upgrade method (as shown below). Using the normal update method (this includes using YaST and PackageKit) rather than the dist-upgrade method will not move the system to the latest snapshot and may cause issues.” This is still in effect for YaST? “YaST2 -> Software Management -> Package -> All Packages -> Update if newer version available” does the same thing as zypper up, correct? (Is YaST -> Software Management a GUI wrapper that invokes /usr/bin/zypper to do the work or does it manage the zypp database directly through /usr/lib64/libzypp.so?)

What you describe indeed performs the equivalent of ‘zypper up’ . AFAIK YaST uses the libzypp backend, not zypper directly. But the rule is simple: do not use YaST to upgrade Tumbleweed. And I don’t see a change happening very soon.

Interestingly, I did a “zypper up” yesterday. And I got the warning:


    Consider to cancel:
    Product 'openSUSE Tumbleweed' requires to be updated by calling 'zypper
    dup'!

I went ahead with the zypper up. The reason was that I had several conflicts with “zypper dup”. So I wanted to get most of the updating done with “zypper up” before coming back and retrying the “zypper dup”. The conflicts were mostly related to:


Problem: lxqt-powermanagement-0.14.1-2.9.x86_64 requires libQt5Gui5 = 5.13.1, but this requirement cannot be provided

That would be worth a bug report IMHO. Tumbleweed now has Qt 5.14 …

Already reported as bug 1161833

Yes, “lxqt” seems to be lagging behind the changes in Qt.

Still another variant:

erlangen:~ # zypper up
Loading repository data...
Reading installed packages...

The following 177 package updates will NOT be installed:
  GeoIP GeoIP-data Mesa Mesa-dri Mesa-gallium Mesa-libEGL1 Mesa-libGL1 Mesa-libglapi0 Mesa-libva autoconf automake btrfsmaintenance btrfsprogs btrfsprogs-udev-rules desktop-data-openSUSE dosfstools dracut ffmpeg-4 filezilla
  ...
Nothing to do.
erlangen:~ # 

When in doubt zypper dup is the preferred method. Since switching to Tumbleweed annoyances are minimized by adjusting priorities and using the parameters given below:

erlangen:~ # zypper lr -uEP
#  | Alias               | Name                                           | Enabled | GPG Check | Refresh | Priority | URI                                                                              
---+---------------------+------------------------------------------------+---------+-----------+---------+----------+----------------------------------------------------------------------------------
 3 | Packman             | Packman                                        | Yes     | (r ) Yes  | Yes     |   **90**     | http://ftp.fau.de/packman/suse/openSUSE_Tumbleweed/                              
 8 | openSUSE-20191106-0 | openSUSE-20191106-0                            | Yes     | (r ) Yes  | Yes     |   **99**     | http://download.opensuse.org/tumbleweed/repo/oss/                                
11 | repo-non-oss        | openSUSE-Tumbleweed-Non-Oss                    | Yes     | (r ) Yes  | Yes     |   **99**     | http://download.opensuse.org/tumbleweed/repo/non-oss/                            
13 | repo-update         | openSUSE-Tumbleweed-Update                     | Yes     | (r ) Yes  | Yes     |   **99**     | http://download.opensuse.org/update/tumbleweed/                                  
 1 | Application_Geo     | Application_Geo                                | Yes     | (r ) Yes  | Yes     |  **100**     | http://download.opensuse.org/repositories/Application:/Geo/openSUSE_Tumbleweed/  
 2 | BellSoft            | BellSoft Repository                            | Yes     | ( p) Yes  | Yes     |  **100**     | http://yum.bell-sw.com/                                                          
 4 | home_Herbster0815   | MyStuff (openSUSE_Tumbleweed)                  | Yes     | (r ) Yes  | Yes     |  **100**     | http://download.opensuse.org/repositories/home:/Herbster0815/openSUSE_Tumbleweed/
 5 | home_X0F_HSF        | Hackeurs Sans Frontières (openSUSE_Tumbleweed) | Yes     | (r ) Yes  | Yes     |  **100**     | http://download.opensuse.org/repositories/home:/X0F:/HSF/openSUSE_Tumbleweed/    
 6 | jalbum              | jalbum                                         | Yes     | (  ) No   | Yes     |  **100**     | http://jalbum.net/download/software/yumrepo/                                     
 7 | myrepo              | myrepo                                         | Yes     | (  ) No   | Yes     |  **100**     | dir:/home/karl/Downloads/myrepo                                                  
 9 | opensuse-guide.org  | libdvdcss repository                           | Yes     | (r ) Yes  | Yes     |  **100**     | http://opensuse-guide.org/repo/openSUSE_Tumbleweed/                              
erlangen:~ # **zypper dup --allow-vendor-change --auto-agree-with-licenses  --allow-downgrade** 
Loading repository data...
Reading installed packages...
Warning: You are about to do a distribution upgrade with all enabled repositories. Make sure these repositories are compatible before you continue. See 'man zypper' for more information about this command.
Computing distribution upgrade...

Nothing to do.
erlangen:~ # 

I just did the exact same thing today. I’ll just go and re-inform the fellow. (**** I dislike having egg on my face :stuck_out_tongue: )

Hi
Be aware, this is a Plasma/Packagekit thing (and a bug report to be created if have issues) only by the looks… besides packagekit, like plymouth and lang packages is removed here :wink: I will stick to zypper -vvv dup :slight_smile: