Seeking advice on upgrading from 15.6

I’ve been running Suse on my ancient machine since Leap 42.1. My machine is a Dell Vostro 8500, built in 2012. It is Ivy Bridge (i-7), 24GB Ram, no TPM-2 but has SSE-3,4 & SSSE3. I tried v16 but it was so slow that I used snapshot to go back to 15.6. Maybe ram is all I need but with today’s ram shortage I’m not looking at that possibility. The only reason I’m considering this upgrade is 15.6 eol. I run KDE.

I guess I will need a newer machine. I’m considering looking at my local used supply house, they mostly have off-lease Dell stuff pre-installed with MS software which I will wipe.

I’m interested in knowing hw requirements such as ram and other stuff I have not kept up with. Maybe even replacing the MB. I will repurpose my existing SATA drive if they still have that capability. I’m not a gamer, just an avg old guy with low usage. I require cat 5 connection and generally will not use wifi unless I have to. My most intensive stuff is recording music w/ audacity, or perhaps a newer replacement.

And, if I switch to TW will my current system live to see a new day?

Appreciate any advise on options

@6520302 Hi, could be the intel GPU, can you post the output from inxi -GSaz

It should run fine, plenty of RAM, I’m running Leap 16.0 on similar hardware with 8GB with GNOME.

System:
  Kernel: 6.12.0-160000.29-default arch: x86_64 bits: 64 compiler: gcc
    v: 13.4.0 clocksource: tsc avail: hpet,acpi_pm
    parameters: BOOT_IMAGE=/boot/vmlinuz-6.12.0-160000.29-default
    root=UUID=f6eeb995-ce11-41ac-85b8-9b085806c0be mitigations=auto quiet
    security=selinux selinux=1 intel_iommu=on
  Desktop: GNOME v: 48.4 tk: GTK v: 3.24.50 wm: gnome-shell
    tools: gsd-screensaver-proxy dm: GDM v: 48.0 Distro: openSUSE Leap 16.0
Graphics:
  Device-1: Intel 3rd Gen Core processor Graphics vendor: Apple driver: i915
    v: kernel arch: Gen-7 process: Intel 22nm built: 2012-13 ports: active: none
    empty: VGA-1 bus-ID: 00:02.0 chip-ID: 8086:0166 class-ID: 0300
  Device-2: NVIDIA GK107M [GeForce GT 650M Mac Edition] vendor: Apple
    driver: nouveau v: kernel non-free: series: 470.xx+
    status: legacy-active (EOL~2024-09-xx) arch: Kepler-2 code: GKxxx
    process: TSMC 28nm built: 2012-2018 pcie: gen: 1 speed: 2.5 GT/s lanes: 8
    link-max: gen: 3 speed: 8 GT/s lanes: 16 ports: active: eDP-1
    empty: DP-1,DP-2,HDMI-A-1 bus-ID: 01:00.0 chip-ID: 10de:0fd5
    class-ID: 0300 temp: 42.0 C
  Device-3: Apple FaceTime HD Camera (Built-in) driver: uvcvideo type: USB
    rev: 2.0 speed: 480 Mb/s lanes: 1 mode: 2.0 bus-ID: 1-1.1:3
    chip-ID: 05ac:8510 class-ID: 0e02 serial: <filter>
  Display: wayland server: Xwayland v: 24.1.6 compositor: gnome-shell
    driver: gpu: nouveau display-ID: 0
  Monitor-1: eDP-1 model: Apple Color LCD built: 2011 res: mode: 2880x1800
    hz: 60 scale: 100% (1) dpi: 221 gamma: 1.2 size: 330x210mm (13.03x8.15")
    diag: 390mm (15.4") ratio: 16:10 modes: max: 2880x1800 min: 800x600
  API: EGL v: 1.5 hw: drv: intel crocus drv: nvidia nouveau platforms:
    device: 0 drv: crocus device: 1 drv: nouveau device: 2 drv: swrast gbm:
    drv: crocus surfaceless: drv: crocus wayland: drv: nouveau x11:
    drv: nouveau
  API: OpenGL v: 4.5 compat-v: 4.2 vendor: mesa v: 24.3.3 glx-v: 1.4
    direct-render: yes renderer: NVE7 device-ID: 10de:0fd5 memory: 978.5 MiB
    unified: no display-ID: :0.0
  API: Vulkan v: 1.4.309 layers: 1 device: 0 type: integrated-gpu name: Intel
    HD Graphics 4000 (IVB GT2) driver: mesa intel v: 24.3.3
    device-ID: 8086:0166 surfaces: xcb,xlib,wayland
  Info: Tools: api: eglinfo, glxinfo, vulkaninfo gpu: gputop,
    intel_gpu_top, lsgpu wl: wayland-info x11: xprop,xrandr

@malcolmlewis Looks like you repurposed a macbook, perhaps?

My system came with an Radeon HD 7570, AFAIK, the onboard Intel GPU is disabled. Anyway, here is inxi -GSaz

System:
  Kernel: 6.4.0-150600.23.100-default arch: x86_64 bits: 64 compiler: gcc
    v: 7.5.0 parameters: BOOT_IMAGE=/boot/vmlinuz-6.4.0-150600.23.100-default
    root=UUID=f31fab0a-b3cb-4890-aa75-852d93019081 video=1280x1024
    resume=/dev/disk/by-uuid/caeb1bb8-4c03-466b-99f9-1b247b4d0a9b vga=791
    resume=/dev/disk/by-label/linux-swap splash=silent quiet showopts
  Desktop: KDE Plasma v: 5.27.11 tk: Qt v: 5.15.12 wm: kwin_x11 vt: 2
    dm: SDDM Distro: openSUSE Leap 15.6
Graphics:
  Device-1: AMD Turks PRO [Radeon HD 7570] vendor: Dell driver: radeon
    v: kernel alternate: amdgpu arch: TeraScale-2 code: Evergreen
    process: TSMC 32-40nm built: 2009-15 pcie: gen: 2 speed: 5 GT/s lanes: 16
    ports: active: HDMI-A-1 empty: DVI-I-1 bus-ID: 01:00.0 chip-ID: 1002:675d
    class-ID: 0300 temp: 32.5 C
  Display: x11 server: X.Org v: 1.21.1.11 with: Xwayland v: 24.1.1
    compositor: kwin_x11 driver: X: loaded: radeon
    unloaded: fbdev,modesetting,vesa dri: r600 gpu: radeon display-ID: :0
    screens: 1
  Screen-1: 0 s-res: 1680x1050 s-dpi: 84 s-size: 508x285mm (20.00x11.22")
    s-diag: 582mm (22.93")
  Monitor-1: HDMI-A-1 mapped: HDMI-0 model: Samsung SMB2330HD built: 2010
    res: 1680x1050 hz: 60 dpi: 84 gamma: 1.2 size: 510x290mm (20.08x11.42")
    diag: 587mm (23.1") ratio: 16:9 modes: max: 1920x1080 min: 720x400
  API: OpenGL v: 4.5 Mesa 23.3.4 renderer: AMD TURKS (DRM 2.50.0 /
    6.4.0-150600.23.100-default LLVM 17.0.6) direct-render: Yes

@6520302 Yes, circa late 2012 MacBook Pro, it dual boots with Monteray and leap 16.0.

I’d be tempted to switch to the Intel GPU and see how that goes, if @mrmazda is around, then he may offer some suggestions on the AMD GPU and leap 16.0.

Thanks, if I don’t hear from @mrmazda I’ll give that a try. I used one of his prior posts to determine that my MB would run v16. At any rate, I expect in the near future there will be ‘improvements’ to v16 that will obsolete my ancient Dell but your success with the Mac gives me hope to experiment with the intel GPU.

If I remove the AMD and activate the Intel will a simple startup detect this or do I have to perform some magic to make this switch?

@6520302 No it will just start working, you might need to add some supporting libs eg the intel vulkan one etc.

But I will be prompted right, not get a crash screen? IE: A notification that I have to download xyz and on install it will restart?

I have no experience with either Sandy Bridge or Ivy Bridge. Everything I have with 16.0 on it is either a little or more newer, or older. The older is 2 Intel CPU generations older, 2010 with Ironlake i5-660 using the Gen5 on-CPU GPU. Both Terascale 2 GPUs I have are coupled with CPUs that don’t support Leap 16. So, I cannot comment based on direct experience, but I do have a pair of generation subsequent to Ivy Bridge Haswells using Intel Gen7 graphics that seem plenty spunky with 16G or more RAM. Note however I’ve nearly eradicated Plasma here, only a small handful of installations on newer hardware. Everything else is running KDE3 and/or TDE.

All that said, I can’t imagine Plasma being the slug described in OP, unless it was hamstrung by having been installed using the nomodeset kernel cmdline option that wasn’t removed post-installation. Historically that’s been a common problem readily fixed if recognized.

Traditionally, Dell cases haven’t been very accommodating to generic motherboards, but I’ve seen a number of the “newer” ones really are generic enough for mATX motherboards as long as the cables from the front panel switches and sockets are close enough to generic to make work. Front USB cables generally are standard enough, but the PC speaker, power switch and some others can be frustrating. IIRC, Vostros may be one such model line, but I can’t swear to it. Genuine generic cases have separate plastic connectors per purpose, usually with two wire connectors each for those various bits, while brand name cases, “generic” or not, couple sometimes 11 or more connectors that must be removed from their original plastic and connected one by one to a generic motherboard, a tedious job even if old eyes are good enough to deal with mousetype .pdf manuals and motherboard connector stencils.

I would give your current Vostro another try with 16.0 before spending money on newer hardware, unless you know neither nomodeset nor some uncommon but fixable old radeon problem were handicapping you.

As @malcolmlewis suggested, it might be worth comparing your Terascale GPU to your CPU’s GPU (if it actually has one - look up your CPU model on intel.com to confirm). Run glmark2 to get a simple number to compare to running it again after removing it. Assuming the Vostro has the HDMI connection you need for your Samsung, the CPU’s GPU should work automatically, as long as kernel-firmware-i915 is installed and no override configuration(s) is in place for the removed Terascale.

Then again, off-lease computers can be a really good value. I still have Dell SFF Optiplex 760 and 780 models from 2008 I bought as “refurbs” still working well enough with 15.6, Tumbleweed, Debian, Mageia, Fedora and *buntu. That seems to suggest today’s “refurbs” ought to be good for 8-10 years or more.

Felix, thanks for the tips. And thanks for all those great tips back when you were active w/ os/2.

At one time I had nomodeset in grub but looking at grub2/grub.cfg I don’t see it there. I’d have to check again on bootup to be sure.

The Intel GPU is an HD 4000.

You lost me on kernel-firmware-i915, installed from where to where?. And I’m not familiar w/ Terascale so will need to do some research but will look into glmark2. The Vostro does have the ports for vga/hdmi covered but they are accessible. So I will at least try pulling out the Radeon and activating the onboard video.

Thanks again for this info

@6520302 On you Leap 15.6 setup, just zypper in kernel-firmware-i915

I have at least three or more systems with HD 4000 GPU’s, I tested some of them with Leap 16.0 awhile back, but they don’t run any desktop environment…

Thanks, I already have the v3.15.1 dated 20250205 in my 15.6. So that is all done. I’ll give these suggestions a try. Appreciate the help.

Oh, one more thing. Does it matter that my bios is set for legacy boot? I personally see no reason to change it but in the last 10+ yrs the advances have left me behind times.

@6520302 AFAIK it will work for now, going forward…maybe not… a gpt formatted disk, UEFI and a 2-4GB partition for /boot/efi type “EF00” formatted vfat would be the option to use and a fresh install…

I thought you had 16.0, but are back to using 15.6? Running cat /proc/cmdline would tell you if your current boot is using it, but as inxi -GSaz in comment #3 shows, your 15.6 isn’t using it.

Terascale 2 is simply the AMD Radeon arch of your HD 7570’s GPU chip.

I tried 16 and found it slow. I restored 15.6 from snapshot. I checked the grub.cfg on the startup and nomodeset is NOT in it. I know I used it many years ago and don’t recall taking it out but I must have.

I pulled out the Radeon & vulkan sez the Intel is not set up properly (and locked to X11) but does not offer what is wrong. Web suggests the error is common on older systems and to use OpenGL. I updated my OpenGL and added some other choices relating to ‘lib’ and Mesa but nothing relating to ‘devel’.

glmark2 has the Radeon is 2533 and the Intel GPU is 997.

guess I’ll put the Radeon back in and try v16 again since Malcom sez his older boxes are running 16 well. Maybe Plasma/KDE needs newer hw.

Thanks again

This is still clear as mud. Are both 15.6 and 16.0 currently installed and bootable, so that you are checking for nomodeset while booted to 16.0?

bruno@LT-B:~> glmark2
=======================================================
    glmark2 2023.01
=======================================================
    OpenGL Information
    GL_VENDOR:      Intel
    GL_RENDERER:    Mesa Intel(R) HD Graphics 4600 (HSW GT2)
    GL_VERSION:     4.6 (Compatibility Profile) Mesa 26.0.6
    Surface Config: buf=32 r=8 g=8 b=8 a=8 depth=24 stencil=0 samples=0
    Surface Size:   800x600 windowed
<snip>
=======================================================
                                  glmark2 Score: 699 
=======================================================

and Leap 16.0 / Plasma / Wayland is working with no problems.
Do you have a slow disk? SSD here…

sorry my description is difficult to understand. I removed 16 and restored my system to 15.6, You asked about nomodeset. I do not use it.

I’m using a mechanical drive, sata 1TB. Offhand, I do not know it’s spec’s but using it from 42.1 through 15.6 has been ok. I found 16 slow. I’ll install 16 again.

I had dismal performance with 200 GB 5400 rpm sata disks and btrfs, but yours is denser and possibly faster; with some configurations btrfs grows more and more fragmented with usage and might slow down if much head movement is involved, but you should be able to hear that as noticeable noise if that is the case.
Otherwise some extra care is needed in disk layout and/or btrfs housekeeping, or use ext4 as I do on slower disks.
Anyway an ssd, even a smaller one, is likely to change your life if btrfs is preferred.
I’m not aware of anything that might slow down Leap 16 compared to 15.6 on the same system and with the same system configuration.
Other specs of your system are way beyond what I use daily.
Maybe detailing what you mean as “slow” or when it feels “slow” might help us suggest something else.

My point was that because you removed 16.0, you don’t know and cannot check whether or not you had nomodeset employed in its Grub because you didn’t check prior to removing 16.0, unless you made a backup of 16.0’s Grub prior to making it disappear, or you had another help thread somewhere about your 16.0 disappointment that included this significant handicapping configuration detail.