RAM memory on an old computer

English Hardware
#1

I am running open SUSE 11.0 on this old computer.

It has an old socket 939 processor from AMD.

The computer works fine.

The motherboard is ASROCk A 939.

I have 2 GB of RAM. They are old PC 3200 and 400MHZ.

I want to remove one of the 512MB RAM module and insert a 2 GB module.

I don’t know whether this support by the motherboard.

I looked at the homepage of ASROCK. There is no information.

I want your advice on this.

The computer has 3 slots to put RAM memory.

I have 1GB module and 2 modulse of 51MB

ASRock Motherboard - Product - K8 Combo-Z - Overview

#2

from what manufacturer is the 2gb memory?
I suggest that you jsut try by changing the memory like you sayed
and check that bios setups is ok, and look how the bios and suse recognise the ram.

#3

Mixing memory can cause problems … there is no guarantee that a mix of:

  • 1 x 2GB module
  • 1 x 1GB module
  • 1 x 512MB module
    will work together. Your computer could end up freezing or rebooting unexpected and very randomly as a result. If that happens, you could be OOL (out of luck).

IMHO you should have a backup plan as to how you can revert to your old stable configuration (if this does not work) while minimizing your financial risk.

You can also obtain more information on your PC’s memory hardware by running “dmidecode”:

#4

Thank you for that oldcpu! As an informal student of Linux I am always happy to learn new commands!
As an aside, have you checked out the book Suse Linux Toolbox? I am thinking of picking it up off Amazon.
Cheers.

#5

Thanks old_cpu for the comments.

You helped me a lot in the past.

In the good old days I had the username Ullrich.

Do you remember that Ullrich who had grave problems with the sound card?

You helped me several days in a row solve the problem.

I did not post a question for about 10 months to the open SUSE forums. The forum refused to accept the old username. The forum administrators have done some changes.

So I created a new username Gold123.

I have two 512MB modules and the other slot was empty.

Nearly two weeks ago I inserted a single 1GB module to the empty slot.

It works fine though they are from different manufacturers.

  1. I can remove the 512MB modules and insert two of 1GB.

  2. I can remove the 512MB modules and insert a 2GB module.

What is the best alternative?


ni@linux-j5q7:~> free
             total       used       free     shared    buffers     cached
Mem:       2060968     907208    1153760          0      32756     468536
-/+ buffers/cache:     405916    1655052
Swap:      3148700          0    3148700
ni@linux-j5q7:~>
#6 


linux-j5q7:/home/n # dmidecode
# dmidecode 2.9
SMBIOS 2.3 present.
7 structures occupying 349 bytes.
Table at 0x000FC850.

Handle 0x0000, DMI type 0, 20 bytes
BIOS Information
        Vendor: American Megatrends Inc.
        Version: L2.31
        Release Date: 08/30/2005
        Address: 0xF0000
        Runtime Size: 64 kB
        ROM Size: 256 kB
        Characteristics:
                PCI is supported
                BIOS is upgradeable
                BIOS shadowing is allowed
                Boot from CD is supported
                Selectable boot is supported
                BIOS ROM is socketed
                EDD is supported
                5.25"/1.2 MB floppy services are supported (int 13h)
                3.5"/720 KB floppy services are supported (int 13h)
                3.5"/2.88 MB floppy services are supported (int 13h)
                Print screen service is supported (int 5h)
                8042 keyboard services are supported (int 9h)
                Serial services are supported (int 14h)
                Printer services are supported (int 17h)
                CGA/mono video services are supported (int 10h)
                ACPI is supported
                USB legacy is supported
                AGP is supported
                LS-120 boot is supported
                ATAPI Zip drive boot is supported
                BIOS boot specification is supported

Handle 0x0001, DMI type 1, 25 bytes
System Information
        Manufacturer: TBD
        Product Name: K8 Combo-Z
        Version: 1.00
        Serial Number: 00000000
        UUID: 00020003-0004-0005-0006-000700080009
        Wake-up Type: Power Switch

Handle 0x0002, DMI type 2, 8 bytes
Base Board Information
        Manufacturer: TBD
        Product Name: K8 Combo-Z
        Version: 1.00
        Serial Number: 00000000

Handle 0x0003, DMI type 4, 35 bytes
Processor Information
        Socket Designation: CPUSocket
        Type: Central Processor
        Family: Athlon 64
        Manufacturer: AMD
        ID: 72 0F 03 00 FF FB 8B 07
        Signature: Family 15, Model 55, Stepping 2
        Flags:
                FPU (Floating-point unit on-chip)
                VME (Virtual mode extension)
                DE (Debugging extension)
                PSE (Page size extension)
                TSC (Time stamp counter)
                MSR (Model specific registers)
                PAE (Physical address extension)
                MCE (Machine check exception)
                CX8 (CMPXCHG8 instruction supported)
                APIC (On-chip APIC hardware supported)
                SEP (Fast system call)
                MTRR (Memory type range registers)
                PGE (Page global enable)
                MCA (Machine check architecture)
                CMOV (Conditional move instruction supported)
                PAT (Page attribute table)
                PSE-36 (36-bit page size extension)
                CLFSH (CLFLUSH instruction supported)
                MMX (MMX technology supported)
                FXSR (Fast floating-point save and restore)
                SSE (Streaming SIMD extensions)
                SSE2 (Streaming SIMD extensions 2)
        Version: AMD Athlon(tm) 64 Processor 4000+
        Voltage: 3.3 V 2.9 V
        External Clock: 200 MHz
        Max Speed: 2400 MHz
        Current Speed: 2400 MHz
        Status: Populated, Enabled
        Upgrade: Socket 754
        L1 Cache Handle: 0x0004
        L2 Cache Handle: 0x0005
        L3 Cache Handle: Not Provided
        Serial Number: TBD
        Asset Tag: TBD
        Part Number: TBD

Handle 0x0004, DMI type 7, 19 bytes
Cache Information
        Socket Designation: L1-Cache
        Configuration: Enabled, Not Socketed, Level 1
        Operational Mode: Varies With Memory Address
        Location: Internal
        Installed Size: 128 KB
        Maximum Size: 128 KB
        Supported SRAM Types:
                Pipeline Burst
        Installed SRAM Type: Pipeline Burst
        Speed: Unknown
        Error Correction Type: Single-bit ECC
        System Type: Data
        Associativity: 4-way Set-associative

Handle 0x0005, DMI type 7, 19 bytes
Cache Information
        Socket Designation: L2-Cache
        Configuration: Enabled, Not Socketed, Level 2
        Operational Mode: Varies With Memory Address
        Location: Internal
        Installed Size: 1024 KB
        Maximum Size: 1024 KB
        Supported SRAM Types:
                Pipeline Burst
        Installed SRAM Type: Pipeline Burst
        Speed: Unknown
        Error Correction Type: Single-bit ECC
        System Type: Unified
        Associativity: 4-way Set-associative

Handle 0x0006, DMI type 127, 4 bytes
End Of Table

linux-j5q7:/home/ni #
#7

It seems old_cpu has not seen my latest post.
**
I badly need your advice on this.**

I want to buy more RAM.

Because this will enhance the overall speed of the system.

#8

Are you certain you can expand this PC’s memory? Did you post all of the dmidecode? It looks incomplete to my first look.

Typically there is an entry for each memory bank, and I don’t see that. All I see is:

        Installed Size: 1024 KB
        Maximum Size: 1024 KB

Is there any way you can consult with the store where you purchased the PC to get their advice?

#9

On 2008-08-02, Gold123 <Gold123@no-mx.forums.opensuse.org> wrote:
>
> It seems old_cpu has not seen my latest post.
>
> I BADLY NEED YOUR ADVICE ON THIS.
>
> I want to buy more RAM.
>
> Because this will enhance the overall speed of the system.

You have a 2.4 GHz AMD 64, and call than an old machine ?
Seems like a good one, to me.

But anyway, what do you hope to gain? You allready have 2GB. Any
memory-hungry application that consumes 2GB will probably overflow on 2.5 or
3GB, too.

What kind of use do you put this machine too?

–
The sand remembers once there was beach and sunshine
but chip is warm too
– haiku from Effector Online, Volume 1, Number 6

#10

Further to this, here is what I get when I run demidecode on my main PC. I get alot more output than what you provided.
general pastebin - oldcpu dmidecode of main pc - post number 1091601

I get 48-structures … yet your dmidecode only provided 7. Can you try running it again?

#11

When I run dmidecode on my much older PC, that I use for test purposes, I get 22-structures, which is still WAY more than your 7.
general pastebin - dmidecode output - post number 1091604

#12

Thanks for the replies. I looked at the dmidecode command again. The following is the output. Yes, old_cpu that it has only 7 structures. I don’t know why.

Maybe you got a better computer. Mine is old. I think this is nudging 4th year now. The computer works fine. I threw away the 3200 ++ AMD processor and inserted a 4000 ++ AMD processor.

The motherboard belongs to the old school. It has a 939 socket. I think AMD has buried the 939 sockets. Now it is AM2.


ni@linux-j5q7:~> su -
Password:
linux-j5q7:~ # dmidecode
# dmidecode 2.9
SMBIOS 2.3 present.
7 structures occupying 349 bytes.
Table at 0x000FC850.

Handle 0x0000, DMI type 0, 20 bytes
BIOS Information
        Vendor: American Megatrends Inc.
        Version: L2.31
        Release Date: 08/30/2005
        Address: 0xF0000
        Runtime Size: 64 kB
        ROM Size: 256 kB
        Characteristics:
                PCI is supported
                BIOS is upgradeable
                BIOS shadowing is allowed
                Boot from CD is supported
                Selectable boot is supported
                BIOS ROM is socketed
                EDD is supported
                5.25"/1.2 MB floppy services are supported (int 13h)
                3.5"/720 KB floppy services are supported (int 13h)
                3.5"/2.88 MB floppy services are supported (int 13h)
                Print screen service is supported (int 5h)
                8042 keyboard services are supported (int 9h)
                Serial services are supported (int 14h)
                Printer services are supported (int 17h)
                CGA/mono video services are supported (int 10h)
                ACPI is supported
                USB legacy is supported
                AGP is supported
                LS-120 boot is supported
                ATAPI Zip drive boot is supported
                BIOS boot specification is supported

Handle 0x0001, DMI type 1, 25 bytes
System Information
        Manufacturer: TBD
        Product Name: K8 Combo-Z
        Version: 1.00
        Serial Number: 00000000
        UUID: 00020003-0004-0005-0006-000700080009
        Wake-up Type: Power Switch

Handle 0x0002, DMI type 2, 8 bytes
Base Board Information
        Manufacturer: TBD
        Product Name: K8 Combo-Z
        Version: 1.00
        Serial Number: 00000000

Handle 0x0003, DMI type 4, 35 bytes
Processor Information
        Socket Designation: CPUSocket
        Type: Central Processor
        Family: Athlon 64
        Manufacturer: AMD
        ID: 72 0F 03 00 FF FB 8B 07
        Signature: Family 15, Model 55, Stepping 2
        Flags:
                FPU (Floating-point unit on-chip)
                VME (Virtual mode extension)
                DE (Debugging extension)
                PSE (Page size extension)
                TSC (Time stamp counter)
                MSR (Model specific registers)
                PAE (Physical address extension)
                MCE (Machine check exception)
                CX8 (CMPXCHG8 instruction supported)
                APIC (On-chip APIC hardware supported)
                SEP (Fast system call)
                MTRR (Memory type range registers)
                PGE (Page global enable)
                MCA (Machine check architecture)
                CMOV (Conditional move instruction supported)
                PAT (Page attribute table)
                PSE-36 (36-bit page size extension)
                CLFSH (CLFLUSH instruction supported)
                MMX (MMX technology supported)
                FXSR (Fast floating-point save and restore)
                SSE (Streaming SIMD extensions)
                SSE2 (Streaming SIMD extensions 2)
        Version: AMD Athlon(tm) 64 Processor 4000+
        Voltage: 3.3 V 2.9 V
        External Clock: 200 MHz
        Max Speed: 2400 MHz
        Current Speed: 2400 MHz
        Status: Populated, Enabled
        Upgrade: Socket 754
        L1 Cache Handle: 0x0004
        L2 Cache Handle: 0x0005
        L3 Cache Handle: Not Provided
        Serial Number: TBD
        Asset Tag: TBD
        Part Number: TBD

Handle 0x0004, DMI type 7, 19 bytes
Cache Information
        Socket Designation: L1-Cache
        Configuration: Enabled, Not Socketed, Level 1
        Operational Mode: Varies With Memory Address
        Location: Internal
        Installed Size: 128 KB
        Maximum Size: 128 KB
        Supported SRAM Types:
                Pipeline Burst
        Installed SRAM Type: Pipeline Burst
        Speed: Unknown
        Error Correction Type: Single-bit ECC
        System Type: Data
        Associativity: 4-way Set-associative

Handle 0x0005, DMI type 7, 19 bytes
Cache Information
        Socket Designation: L2-Cache
        Configuration: Enabled, Not Socketed, Level 2
        Operational Mode: Varies With Memory Address
        Location: Internal
        Installed Size: 1024 KB
        Maximum Size: 1024 KB
        Supported SRAM Types:
                Pipeline Burst
        Installed SRAM Type: Pipeline Burst
        Speed: Unknown
        Error Correction Type: Single-bit ECC
        System Type: Unified
        Associativity: 4-way Set-associative

Handle 0x0006, DMI type 127, 4 bytes
End Of Table

linux-j5q7:
#13

Without more detailed hardware info, all I can provide is general cautions:
a. if you mix ram from different suppliers, you can have problems,
b. if you mix ram of different sizes, you can have problems,
c. if you mix ram of same size from same supplier, but different “builds” (ie different construction of the chips on the ram card) you can have problems.

I say ‘can have’ but not for certain. Which means ensure you have a good return policy, or backup plan (to recover your expenditure for the ram) if the upgrade plan does not work.

Some good BIOS have features that allow one to tune the RAM timing as a work around to RAM problems. … But many do not. I would be worried about an old PC.

Now some web sites specialize in providing RAM updates, and if you surf and find those websites, they will ask for your motherboard info, and you can insert that, and get their recommendation as to how to do a RAM update.

But you are taking quite a bit of risk in this update, so be prepared with a contingency plan for the worst.

Two examples:
(a) updated my wife’s PC from 512MB to 1GB with RAM from same supplier, with same timing on card, but card built different. Constant crashes in windows and Linux on her PC. :eek: Eventually we found a setting in BIOS on her PC to change RAM timing of motherboard, and problem went away.

(b) updated my PC RAM from 1GB (2 x 512MB) to 2GB (2 x 512MB + 1 x 1GB) with RAM from same supplier. Constant crashes/reboots. :eek: I changed my BIOS setting. Crash frequency dropped by 50% but still constant crashes. I then changed the position of the memory cards in the memory slots, and found one positioning of the memory cards where the crashes no longer happen.

So you can see this is fraught with risk. I was lucky.

I have no golden solutions :rolleyes: (sorry, pun intended) :smiley:

#14

A possibility for a backup plan: Compare hardware / memory on various PCS’s with your MS-Windows (or Linux) friends and their PCs, and see if you can come up with a backup scheme where if your memory upgrade does not work, you can swap memory cards with them and their PCs, to see if you can find a solution that helps both them and you.

#15

I have refurbished many old machines mix-matching RAM in many I have found that the most important thing is to match the VOLTAGE.
As long as the default voltage is the same having different timings the RAM will run @ the slowest DIM’s timing.

#16

Thanks everybody for the replies.

Old_cpu, you have given me a lengthy reply. It was very kind of you to take time to write a lengthy reply.

The reason I want to do this is that I want to get more speed.

Usually I open 15-20 websites.

It is my understanding more RAM creats some speed.

I have a AMD 4000+ processor.

I have 1GB RAM module and 2 of 512MB modules.

I have a 3.0 GB swap partition.

The graphic card is ATI-9250-128 [Just 128MB memory.]

**Do you think a new graphic card will give me more speed?
**
I can insert a graphic card which has 1GB memory.

Recently I removed the old 3200 ++ processr and inserted 4000 ++ processor. I got some speed.

Generally speaking I don’t use applications which has a lot of graphics.**

Your thoughts are welcome.**

BoloMarkIII has touced on the topic of voltage.
What is it in this context?
How do I know it?
I just buy them and insert inside the computer.

#17

More RAM means you can run more applications simultaneous, and hence avoid going into swap, which equates to more speed.

Also some apps (such as NLE video editors) are significantly more stable with more RAM.

Some one who knows something about graphic cards, which I do NOT, will have to answer that.

I’ll tell you a story, … I was participating in IRC #suse the other day, and there was a thread going on about new graphic cards, and how it helped the users play better games, get better 3D graphics. Someone was complaining about the Nvidia cards, they recalled that I had a video chipset (but could not remember how old my card was), and they asked how I found the Nvidia card performance with games.

I noted the video performance was GREAT for the games that I played.

They were somewhat puzzled about my lack of complaint with my old nVidia chipset and then asked what game did I play that gave such superb video performance?

I truefully replied: Chess. :rolleyes:
Games/Chess - openSUSE

#18

**Thanks oldcpu for taking time again to reply me.
**
I don’t play games. I never play games. Games do not provoke my interest. I have heard expensive graphic cards for people who play games.

When I find time I try to learn shell scripting. Sometimes I run router simulators. Even C and C++ interstes me.

I know people are crazy about games.

I know the fast processors give more speed.

I had an AMD 3200 ++ processor. I inserted AMD 4000 ++ processor.

You might wonder why I didn’t buy an AMD 4500 ++ or something higher.

It seems they don’t make higher than AMD 4000 ++ for socket 939 based motherboards.

I talked to a couple of shops in Sweden.

They told me something over 4000 ++ does not exist.

They may be wrong.

I know socket 939 is belong to the old school traditons.

I am eager to insert more RAM modules if it helps to enhance speed.

The shops do not accept the RAM modules once the package/seal is broken.

If it does not work, I must return to the shop.

I can’t return once the package is broken.

They are very adament on this policy.

Sweden may be the wrong country.

#19

You confused me there as to your shop policy.

I think you mean if you believe the new RAM chip has failed (and the packaging is broken, as it must be broken to find out if it works) then you can return to the shop. And they will test it to confirm your assessment. But if the RAM is functional, but simply does not work in your PC, then you can not return it. Do I have that correct?

As noted, I still think it smart to have a fall back strategy. i.e. check around the office or with your circle of friends as to who has what PC, and see if you have some “trading” or “selling” options if the memory doesn’t work.

You can always try to sell on ebay (if your new RAM doesn’t work) but after shipping, and the competitive price of ebay, you will take a loss, and do a lot of work selling, for a relatively small amount of money (IMHO).

#20

Thanks oldcpu for the reply.

In Sweden, once you open the package, you can’t return it.

It can be RAM memory or a new hard drive.

**You bring it home, open the package, insert into the computer.

If it does not work, I can’t return it.**

The open package is considered a used product.

Then, of course, I have other ways to sell it as a second hand product.

You touched on ebay here. I have never bought something on ebay. I know some friends who bought stuff from ebay.