OpenSUSE has made me stupid.

English Install/Boot/Login
#1

>sigh<.

I had this computer running well. However running well is an overstatement because none of the unix documentation makes any sense to me. I fumbled through HOURS, tens, maybe even hundreds to get this computer going, all because I needed a linux workstation for using seismic analysis tools, none of which I could ever quite get running.

Then, openSUSE came up with this version 11.4 update and like a squid, I allowed the update to proceed. My computer was lobotomized, and it never booted again, except with a filesystem “file not found” failure message. Because I was working 14 - 16 hours each day for nearly a YEAR, and today is my first day off, I tried to resurrect the computer.

I tried something called GRUB and it only made things worse. So, I tried burning a version 12.3 install disc. I waited two hours for it to download on my nicely functioning Windows 8 computer. However it won’t load: Instead, GRUB just blows through and tries to load what’s on the old hard drives.

Mammit, I’m supposed to be a PhD student and I can’t figure this thing out!! Heck - I’m looking aimlessly through the documentation and ****ed if I can find any solutions. I still can’t find any comprehensible documentation on how things work.

Either I am STUPID, or else Linux has made me stupid. I should just chuck the whole thing into the trash at the landfill, quit my university program, get a divorce, load a change of clothes into a bag, and disappear out west, find a hole in the ground, and pump gasoline at some lonely gas station for food money for the rest of my life. I’m BEYOND sick of this! Top it all off, no one 'round here seems to know enough to help other than to tell me to rip the hard drives out, reformat them with my Windows 8 computer, and start over. Only THAT removes all of my seismic software, my programs and files, my video drivers, and … and… ARGH!!! Isn’t there a way to fix this ****ed thing without blowing all my hard work away? For crying out loud, one day it works, the next day it’s dead and forcing my ignorance and STUPIDITY back into my face!! I don’t have TIME to go to college AND become a linux systems expert at the same time… or is that the requirement for success?? I’ve not even gotten time to learn the stuff I need to learn, like perl / python, R scripting, etcetera, all because I have to stuff around with tinkering on this operating system. Is it ALWAYS going to be like this with Linux / openSUSE?

#2

Okay,
I’m just going to buy me another hard drive and install it.

Then I will do a clean installation, plug the original drive back in, and hopefully retrieve my projects.
>sigh<.

#3

On 05/08/2013 08:56 PM, ws6transam wrote:
> Either I am STUPID, or else Linux has made me stupid.

it sounds like to me you have too many irons in the fire and don’t
have the time needed to become a system administrator for your system…

you probably should hire a qualified sys admin to set up your machine
and let you just be “the user”…a good admin should be able to
administer your machine from afar…but, i don’t know the hourly rate…

even to do that you probably would need to do some reading on being
just a user…here would be a good place to start:
http://doc.opensuse.org/documentation/html/openSUSE/opensuse-startup/

btw, i run 11.4 and can’t remember the last time i had a “made me
stupid” moment…and, all the updates installed in the last year was
pretty much just smooth sailing…i guess you have some strange
selection of conflicting repos…if you ever achieve a bootable
system again i’d suggest you read and follow the paragraph beginning
with “IMPORTANT!” in this post http://tinyurl.com/33qc9vu

and, if you are one of the very few who is happy with Win8 then why
not just use it…surely there must be a wide variety of “seismic
software” for that system.

–
dd

#4

On Wed, 08 May 2013 18:56:02 +0000, ws6transam wrote:

> Is it ALWAYS going to be like this with Linux / openSUSE?

It always takes time to learn a new system.

And if you have questions, we’re here to help. If you have rants or a
need to vent frustrations, that’s what the soapbox is for.

So for this post, did you have specific quesitons you wanted answered, or
did you just want to rant? If the latter, then I’ll move the thread -
but if you have specific questions, please specify them (generally each
unrelated one in its own thread) and someone will be along to help you
out.

Jim

Jim Henderson
openSUSE Forums Administrator
Forum Use Terms & Conditions at http://tinyurl.com/openSUSE-T-C

#5

It’s a plea for help that morphed into a rant, I guess.

For now, I need to first of all, figure out how to undo the damage I caused when the computer popped up with the GRUB prompt. Then, I need to figure out how to undo the damage that occurred by the 11.4 auto-update. Then, I need to figure out how to burn a bootable image of the 12.3 installation disc… with a windows 8 computer.

…and unfortunately, all of the affordable geoseismic research software is indeed based on Linux. Some of the packages support only openSUSE, some only Debian. Some require Red hat, and still others are verified for only one specific release of either 32-bit or 64 bit flavor, etcetera. Most of these have virtually no GUI and require a lot of code and/or modification of ASCII files to control them.

So, I am at present re-burning my iso onto a DVD to see if it makes a difference. Then, I’ll try to boot from it. I have a new 500GB SATA drive here, and IF I can format it, THEN I can attempt to move on.

System administrator: I have not found any help at the university for Linux, which puzzles me greatly. Additionally, anyone I hire must come out of my $12.50 / hour wages, which means I yield up a week or two worth of my salary to hire someone, I think.

The rant - is pent-up, frustration with a system of documentation that requires one to have pre-knowledge of the documentation system in order to be efficient and effective at learning. I need a short course - haven’t found one quite yet. Maybe I will some day.

[edit] WHOA! Look at that! I reburned the .iso and viola! It boots from the DVD now![/edit]

[edit # 2:] Whoops. It was a fluke. It quit again. " It booted once but now it’s black-screened; with no video. This is a 2.1(ish) Ghz processor with several Gb of RAM - circa 2005 or so.

You can, most likely move this to the soapbox. You are right. It’s 90% rant, 10% ask-for-help. I’ll start again if I keep getting stuck.

#6

Aw,
I thought I had it.

Then I got the message " Unable to create repository from URL ‘cd:/?devices=/dev/disk/by-id/ata-SONY_DVD_RW_DRU-830A’.

Details:
|] Valid Metadata not found at specified URL
History:
-Can’t hardlink/copy/var/adm/mount/AP_0xy19t7d/media.1/media to /var/cache/zypp/raw/cd-db69d9657qsts1
-Can’t provide /media.1/media

I’ve tried it as if it’s a CD and a DVD with pretty much the same error message, only substitute DVD in place of the letters CD.

This is a P5, 2.67Ghz on an intel PCB; I can’t imagine it’s THAT too out of the ordinary…

#7

OK, please calm down. We will try tp help you. You did get openSUSE very cheap, didn’t you? :wink:

First of all, where do you get this error message?
Is it during installation, or in the running system?

#8

On 2013-05-08 22:06, ws6transam wrote:
>
> It’s a plea for help that morphed into a rant, I guess.
>
> For now, I need to first of all, figure out how to undo the damage I
> caused when the computer popped up with the GRUB prompt. Then, I need to
> figure out how to undo the damage that occurred by the 11.4 auto-update.

I wonder what was that “update” you mention. A normal update does not
destroy a system, so you did something strange there.

What did you have before, another openSUSE version? There may be ways to
recover it.

> Then, I need to figure out how to burn a bootable image of the 12.3
> installation disc… with a windows 8 computer.

Well, there are instructions for that on the download page. I have not
tried myself, I don’t have W8, and I use W7 very little - and never for
that task.

> …and unfortunately, all of the affordable geoseismic research
> software is indeed based on Linux. Some of the packages support only
> openSUSE, some only Debian. Some require Red hat, and still others are
> verified for only one specific release of either 32-bit or 64 bit
> flavor, etcetera. Most of these have virtually no GUI and require a lot
> of code and/or modification of ASCII files to control them.

Possibly.

Be careful, because if you install 12.3 in there it will probably
destroy those seismic software you talk about, because it formats the
partition.

> System administrator: I have not found any help at the university for
> Linux, which puzzles me greatly. Additionally, anyone I hire must come
> out of my $12.50 / hour wages, which means I yield up a week or two
> worth of my salary to hire someone, I think.

Well, it is my feeling that at universities there are a lot of Linux
users and help groups. However, it is true that it is easier to find
someone to help you with Windows than it is for Linux. We typically help
one another remotely, via questions in forums or mail lists, like here.
But it means that you have to do the things yourself, and if you are not
of the computer geeky type, it can be difficult.

Maybe you are unlucky and at your university there is no Linux help club.

> The rant - is pent-up, frustration with a system of documentation that
> requires one to have pre-knowledge of the documentation system in order
> to be efficient and effective at learning. I need a short course -
> haven’t found one quite yet. Maybe I will some day.

Linux can be hard to learn if you are used to Windows, it takes time.
However, once you learn to handle it, it becomes easier than Windows,
believe me. Many of us have gone that road :wink:

> WHOA! Look at that! I reburned the .iso and viola! It boots from
> the DVD now!

Well, the previous time there could be a download error, or a burning
error. The instructions mention this problem and how to overcome.

–
Cheers / Saludos,

Carlos E. R.
(from 12.1 x86_64 “Asparagus” at Telcontar)

#9

It happened during installation.

Now, after a reboot, all I get is the “Missing operating system” error message.

Let me try to describe what I have here:

This is an Intel P4, 2.66 Ghz with 533Mhz bus. It has two 512MB DDR333 ram onboard for a total of a gigabyte.
It’s an Intel motherboard, equipped with two ultra ATA ports, with two UATA hard drives and a Sony DVD-burner drive on the secondary port. I’ve since disconnected the two hard drives, and installed one fresh (unformatted) 500GB Seagate SATA drive. I’ve attempted to boot with the DVD on the ultra ATA port. THe BIOS is set up to attempt to access the DVD first, followed by hard drives.

The video card is a Nvidia AGP capable of dual monitor which I bought after fighting with another dual-monitor card from another company - but I recall fighting to get this one going too… I don’t relish going there again.

I’ve created two separate .iso of the 12.3 distribution DVDs and neither of them appear to work reliably. They have sometimes booted, sometimes not. At this point I am fresh out of both CDs and DVDs. …and ideas. I’m about ready to dump the whole hardware, go buy me a new barebones system. Unfortunately I need this computer so that I can work from home over the summer. I also need to figure out how to tie it into my home network but that’s a completely separate issue.

Interestingly, while I was pressing buttons and resetting the computer, jumping into and out of the BIOS to look up these settings, the computer is attempting to boot from the DVD with a basic blue screen and the words "openSUSE012.3-DVD-i586-Buil - - " Never mind. A red box just appeared that says “Error reading sector 73570. This DVD is broken”.

>sigh.<

#10

Hi,

>…and unfortunately, all of the affordable geoseismic research software is indeed based on Linux. Some of the packages support only openSUSE, some only Debian. Some require Red >hat, and still others are verified for only one specific release of either 32-bit or 64 bit flavor, etcetera. Most of these have virtually no GUI and require a lot of code and/or modification of >ASCII files to control them.

This seems to be the main source of your problems. Linux being open and free (of charge) is often used as base for kind of low-budget software (no offense meant). Low budget doesn’t mean low qualitiy but, however, esp. for highly specialized programs, the authors may just not bother or have the time to port / update their packages to different distributions or new updates. In this case, it’s rather the authors to blame than Linux itself. Please don’t forget, with every Windows-update you have to BUY the same software, again. The possibilty to set up and control programs with “lot of code and/or modification of ASCII files” is just an option “Linux” provides you to avoid probably high-priced proprietary software. But exactly for that kind of set-up you need some detailed understanding of the environment you are using.

If you still expect ANY help here, you should provide some more information:

What version of openSUSE did you use before the update, what were the programs you installed and what method of installation did you use?

What exactly do you need to save / recover?

  1. The program files
  2. the program config file
  3. your project data?

In either case, wiping the hard disk doesn’t make sense.

Here some basic briefing on the subjects that may be of relevance for you.
openSUSE is installing software from “repositories” which may be put on an installation DVD. But the most important ones are online.
In these repositories you find the “packages” packed for the specific version and even architecture used. Between such packages you have “dependencies”, i.e. they need / provide specific files from / for other packages. The software used for installation / updating usually solves these dependencies and makes suggestions how. These systems are quite reliable if you follow the instructions.
BUT, if you have installed software manually the “package manager” can not resolve the dependencies. If the authors didn’t bother to provide packages for a new version, you will not be able to run the software anymore, unless you find somebody who will create an updated package for the new version - even that is possible.
This is the reason for my initial question. IMHO, you will hardly be able to undo the “damage” the update did. To restore your old system, you need the old repositories, which are not online, anymore.
You may be able to retrieve the old config files provided, the authors of your seismic research software can provide you with the information where these files are stored. In that case you could boot your computer with a live-system and search your HDD.
The same applies to your project data. If the authors followed some basic rules, these data should be stored your home directory. In a standard Linux installation, the home directories may be installed on a separate partition. In that case, you can even do a clean install - without formatting the whole HDD - and remount your old home partition.

GRUB (or newer GRUB2) is just a boot loader. It will provide you with a boot menu and boot option, not more.

The installation DVD will boot, if you have set up your BIOS boot sequence accordingly. It will ask you to choose like boot from HDD, new installation, update, etc. If you don’t do anything, it will boot from HDD, i.e. lead you to your blank screen.

Before formatting your HDD and reinstalling you should consider answer the above questions. And yes, it seems you will have to learn more about setting up Linux systems as your software seems to require such skills.

rds

kasi

Edit:
(Again, too slow my reply.) Yes, it seems you need to reburn your DVD. Probably you should verify the MD5 checksum.

#11

Well, in this case (and after reading all your other rants) I tend to think that your CD/DVD drive may be broken.
Perhaps you could try to install from an USB-stick?
See here for instructions: https://en.opensuse.org/SDB:Live_USB_stick#Bootable_USB_from_DVD_or_Net-install

#12

Okay,
I bought more discs, this time from Verbatim, and cut a third .iso PLUS bought a SATA DVD. Existing machine won’t recognize it - I am thinking that if it doesn’t work with the EIDE Sony, it’s time for fresh motherboard with no EIDE and just SATA hardware.

The installation is to the point where it’s searching for existing linux partitions, and initializing the software repository, and . . . it’s farther an ever before… initializing automatic configuration…initializing time zone…choosing KDE Desktop…partitioning the drive… now creating the first user account. It looks like it’ll work this time. I just hope that when I re-install my old drives to retrieve my data it’ll keep working.

So, it looks like maybe it’s the DVD media that was partly the issue.

Now one final question before I stop for the night:

I am sitting at the screen where under Booting, it says “boot from MBR is disabled”, and "Boot from “/” partition is enabled. Is this really what I should use?

#13

On 2013-05-09 01:26, ws6transam wrote:
> I am sitting at the screen where under Booting, it says “boot from MBR
> is disabled”, and "Boot from “/” partition is enabled. Is this really
> what I should use?

Is this a new, empty disk? In that case, it does not matter, the
defaults will work, but it will work just as well the other way round.

Do you have Windows in the same disk? Then the current way is
preferable, IMO.

–
Cheers / Saludos,

Carlos E. R.
(from 12.1 x86_64 “Asparagus” at Telcontar)

#14

It is because you did not do phd in linux rotfl!
I am no phd but got my linux working in a single try. People say that openSUSE’s DVD provides one of the best installer around.

#15

On 2013-05-08, ws6transam <ws6transam@no-mx.forums.opensuse.org> wrote:
> Mammit, I’m supposed to be a PhD student and I can’t figure this thing
> out!! Heck - I’m looking aimlessly through the documentation and ****ed
> if I can find any solutions. I still can’t find any comprehensible
> documentation on how things work.

Since I work at a University, I understand your frustration. I generally let my PhD students choose their own
distribution. But if they are not already familiar with Linux, I say my priority is for the moment to get the work done.
And it is a tragic truth for me that openSUSE isn’t something I can ever recommend to Linux newcomers. I remember a
recent student struggling with openSUSE 12.2 because he wanted to use what I used, and now’s he much happier in Linux
Mint KDE.

The expection of slamming in the SUSE/openSUSE install DVD and expecting it to `do the job’ is simply not realistic.
Over the last dozen years, I’ve seen many get through the installation procedure only to reboot into GRUB that
subsequently fails to boot into openSUSE for one reason or another, or having sound/video problems if it does boot. And
since they want to use their laptops at home aswell, the answer of managing all the machines myself doesn’t solve the
problem for them.

So I want you to understand three things before you resume your Linux journey.

  1. Linux is not free; you pay with time rather than money.
  2. Check your md5 checksum for every ISO download, and perform a media check for suspect disks.
  3. If you’re using a Desktop, give Linux it’s own hard drive (I usually have 4 partitions for /boot, /, /swap, /home).

I choose openSUSE because IMO it’s the most reliable yet flexible distribution that doesn’t demand you to compile from
source all the time for upgrading or maintenance - which I simply don’t have the time to do. But I certainly would
rather see students getting on with work rather than faffing about with Linux installations. It’s easiest to start with
a batteries-installed distribution (such as Mint) rather than openSUSE. Once you are more familiar with the nuances and
common pitfalls of Linux (e.g. sound is a mess) then nothing stops you coming back.

#16

That seems to be a sensible approach to take, given the circumstances. It would also be worthwhile to consider a “debian-based” distribution for its availability of application programs, e.g. “Linux Mint KDE” as mentioned. Although openSUSE has a large repository of packaged applications, ready for installation, debian probably has the largest number and most diverse package collection of any distribution.

#17

Well an update.

OpenSUSE 12.3 is loaded on the new hard drive, and this is going to be a dedicated Linux machine. I’m seeing a sluggish computer though, and it keeps asking for my password. I am now about to search the SUSE documentation to try and figure out how to name the comptuer in such a way as to access my windows workgroup for file sharing. Then, I’ll re-install Synergy, push the monitors over adjacent to one another and start re-installing my SAC, ANTELOPE, my R and my various Fortran packages that I need for event relocations, beam stacking & such.

I hear you on the issue of Linux not being FREE, that it’s an investment in TIME.

I apologize for everyone the rant yesterday. It was the culmination of almost two years of frustration at getting less done than I would have hoped - as it seems no matter how much time I throw into something, I was seeing little to no progress.

Now that I know I have a workable installation disc, I think maybe I’ll re-install one more time, only this time I’ll do so after purchasing a fresh-from-the-box, motherboard, & processor with modern firmware. I think some of my problems may be the fact that this system is now eleven years old. I don’t need any more problems. - and I will comb this forum for solutions more thoroughly before disparging any more rants (in the appropriate soapbox!)

I’ve got no choice - I MUST get over my acquired Linux phobia as well as learn how to use Matlab, R, and the various command-based application tools for which no suitable GUI yet exists. You have been patient and helpful these past 24 hours, if anything by not ‘feeding the flame’ I very nearly started!

-Dan

#18

On 2013-05-09, ws6transam <ws6transam@no-mx.forums.opensuse.org> wrote:
> I’ve got no choice - I MUST get over my acquired Linux phobia as well
> as learn how to use Matlab, R, and the various command-based application
> tools for which no suitable GUI yet exists. You have been patient and
> helpful these past 24 hours, if anything by not ‘feeding the flame’ I
> very nearly started!

Well while you getting your new parts remember you don’t need openSUSE to use MathWorks MATLAB or R. They run perfectly
well on Debian-based distros and also on Windows (don’t bother with Python on Windows, because the scientific libraries
aren’t properly implemented for 64-bit), and your code should be almost 100% portable between them. And can you expand
on what you mean by `various command-based application tools for which no suitable GUI yet exists’?

#19

I’m going to probably move any future posts over to the soap box.

…but in regards to my messages - I do have R and Matlab on my windows computer, but they are also script-centric: I have to get back to writing code to make them work. It’s the same deal with the seismic software packages. I have to write code and scripts in order to define my vectors and vector fields, and matrices. I have to hand-edit my seismic event files and assemble the pick tables, then run the processes.

[additional rant removed by the author and relocated to the soapbox, if he can figure out how to do so.]

#20

You can start a new thread elsewhere, but we cannot move threads, only forum staff can do that. You could also continue to constructively discuss your openSUSE install here as necessary without ranting. If an unrelated problem occurs or is ongoing, a new thread in the Help section might then be advised on the grounds of getting it seen by more helpers with appropriate experience. :slight_smile: