News Article: SUSE Gets Bought Out Again

I don’t know why but I couldn’t put this in the openSUSE news forum so I put it here instead.

http://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=news_item&px=MTc4OTI

On Mon, 15 Sep 2014 20:36:01 +0000, Scott Swinyard wrote:

> I don’t know why but I couldn’t put this in the openSUSE news forum so I
> put it here instead.

That forum is fed just from news.opensuse.org.

Jim


Jim Henderson
openSUSE Forums Administrator
Forum Use Terms & Conditions at http://tinyurl.com/openSUSE-T-C

At last, SUSE is European again.

Its first 11 years in Germany, and now after 11 years in the US it now relocates to UK.

On Tue, 16 Sep 2014 11:26:01 +0000, DJViking wrote:

> At last, SUSE is European again.
>
> Its first 11 years in Germany, and now after 11 years in the US it now
> relocates to UK.

SUSE has been “European” all along. As part of Attachmate, it’s been run
out of Nuremburg, just as always. Even when it was a part of Novell, it
was managed out of Germany.

Jim


Jim Henderson
openSUSE Forums Administrator
Forum Use Terms & Conditions at http://tinyurl.com/openSUSE-T-C

On 2014-09-16 22:09, Jim Henderson wrote:
> On Tue, 16 Sep 2014 11:26:01 +0000, DJViking wrote:
>
>> At last, SUSE is European again.
>>
>> Its first 11 years in Germany, and now after 11 years in the US it now
>> relocates to UK.
>
> SUSE has been “European” all along. As part of Attachmate, it’s been run
> out of Nuremburg, just as always. Even when it was a part of Novell, it
> was managed out of Germany.

Yes and no. There were some subtle legal differences when SuSE was fully
European. Example: to get Firefox, then Netscape, with full encryption,
we had to download it from ftp.suse.de, because the version on
ftp.suse.com obeyed different laws (USA) and had weaker encryption.
Other packages had similar differences.


Cheers / Saludos,

Carlos E. R.
(from 13.1 x86_64 “Bottle” at Telcontar)

On Tue, 16 Sep 2014 20:58:07 +0000, Carlos E. R. wrote:

> On 2014-09-16 22:09, Jim Henderson wrote:
>> On Tue, 16 Sep 2014 11:26:01 +0000, DJViking wrote:
>>
>>> At last, SUSE is European again.
>>>
>>> Its first 11 years in Germany, and now after 11 years in the US it now
>>> relocates to UK.
>>
>> SUSE has been “European” all along. As part of Attachmate, it’s been
>> run out of Nuremburg, just as always. Even when it was a part of
>> Novell, it was managed out of Germany.
>
> Yes and no. There were some subtle legal differences when SuSE was fully
> European. Example: to get Firefox, then Netscape, with full encryption,
> we had to download it from ftp.suse.de, because the version on
> ftp.suse.com obeyed different laws (USA) and had weaker encryption.
> Other packages had similar differences.

There were legal issues, sure, but that doesn’t change where the
decisions were made.

Jim


Jim Henderson
openSUSE Forums Administrator
Forum Use Terms & Conditions at http://tinyurl.com/openSUSE-T-C

On 2014-09-17 00:54, Jim Henderson wrote:
> On Tue, 16 Sep 2014 20:58:07 +0000, Carlos E. R. wrote:

> There were legal issues, sure, but that doesn’t change where the
> decisions were made.

Where they are taken does not affect me. What they choose does - and
what laws they have to obey does as well. Being European, I have some
preference for European laws :wink:

However, that is often moot for corporations operating in several countries.

For instance, the USA recognizes software patents, but the European
Union does not (last time I looked) - although the USA presses hard our
legislators, often during the summer, when they expect activists not to
notice that they are again trying to pass legislation pro-sw-patents.

To me, just the dream that SUSE would not have to recognize software
patents, is thrilling :slight_smile:

But it may just be a dream.


Cheers / Saludos,

Carlos E. R.
(from 13.1 x86_64 “Bottle” at Telcontar)

On Tue, 16 Sep 2014 23:18:07 +0000, Carlos E. R. wrote:

> However, that is often moot for corporations operating in several
> countries.

And ultimately, that is more or less the point.

Jim


Jim Henderson
openSUSE Forums Administrator
Forum Use Terms & Conditions at http://tinyurl.com/openSUSE-T-C

On 2014-09-16, Jim Henderson <hendersj@no-mx.forums.opensuse.org> wrote:
> SUSE has been “European” all along.

Tell that to the taxman.

There’s a relevant news item now, and you can probably reply to that.

It looks to me that opensuse is relatively independent of its ownership.

On Wed, 17 Sep 2014 12:59:32 +0000, flymail wrote:

> On 2014-09-16, Jim Henderson <hendersj@no-mx.forums.opensuse.org> wrote:
>> SUSE has been “European” all along.
>
> Tell that to the taxman.

I think you’ll find that they pay taxes in the US and in Germany.

Jim


Jim Henderson
openSUSE Forums Administrator
Forum Use Terms & Conditions at http://tinyurl.com/openSUSE-T-C

Tax is one thing, but I don’t think a FISA order has any weight in a European company. In case NSA wants to put a compromised build of a security package in OpenSUSE.

On Mon, 22 Sep 2014 11:56:01 +0000, DJViking wrote:

> Tax is one thing, but I don’t think a FISA order has any weight in a
> European company. In case NSA wants to put a compromised build of a
> security package in OpenSUSE.

There is no evidence that this has ever happened with any distribution.

Jim


Jim Henderson
openSUSE Forums Administrator
Forum Use Terms & Conditions at http://tinyurl.com/openSUSE-T-C

On 2014-09-24 02:12, Jim Henderson wrote:
> On Mon, 22 Sep 2014 11:56:01 +0000, DJViking wrote:
>
>> Tax is one thing, but I don’t think a FISA order has any weight in a
>> European company. In case NSA wants to put a compromised build of a
>> security package in OpenSUSE.
>
> There is no evidence that this has ever happened with any distribution.

There wouldn’t be :-p

(We are quite sensitive to that in Europe nowdays, and after the snowden
case, we don’t believe in denials)

Considering… quite some years ago, the netscape version available on
suse.com was intentionally debilitated, to comply with USA regulations.
The netscape version available on suse.de, instead, was secure (strong
encryption). Other packages were affected (ssh, I think). This was
documented at the time. That’s a precedent of sorts…


Cheers / Saludos,

Carlos E. R.
(from 13.1 x86_64 “Bottle” at Telcontar)

With my long news journalist background, I have not believed in denials for decades before Snowden ever came around. :wink:

On Wed, 24 Sep 2014 11:25:07 +0000, Carlos E. R. wrote:

> On 2014-09-24 02:12, Jim Henderson wrote:
>> On Mon, 22 Sep 2014 11:56:01 +0000, DJViking wrote:
>>
>>> Tax is one thing, but I don’t think a FISA order has any weight in a
>>> European company. In case NSA wants to put a compromised build of a
>>> security package in OpenSUSE.
>>
>> There is no evidence that this has ever happened with any distribution.
>
> There wouldn’t be :-p

Evidence is needed, otherwise it’s just a non-falsifiable guess.

Jim

Jim Henderson
openSUSE Forums Administrator
Forum Use Terms & Conditions at http://tinyurl.com/openSUSE-T-C

Apparently SUSE is still subject to US laws.
I got this when I wanted to download the SLES bash fix

U.S. Export Laws And Regulations
United States export laws and regulations apply to the use or distribution of this Novell product. This product may not be downloaded, exported or redistributed in any form in or to Cuba, Iran, North Korea, Sudan, or Syria or to residents or nationals of any of the aforementioned countries.
You may not export or transfer, whether directly or indirectly, this product, or any portion thereof, or any system containing this product or portion thereof, to anyone outside the United States, without first complying strictly and fully with all export controls that may be imposed on the product by the United States Government (as noted in the U.S. Department of Commerce “Export Administration Regulations”) or any country or organization of nations within whose jurisdiction you reside or do business or to any embargoed or terrorist countries as specified in the U.S. Export laws. You may not use this product for prohibited nuclear, missile, or chemical biological weaponry end uses. Upon request, Novell will provide you specific information regarding applicable restrictions. Novell assumes no responsibility or liability for your failure to obtain any necessary export approvals. By downloading this software product you agree to the following:
I certify that I am not restricted from receiving U.S. goods;
I certify that I am not located in, or a national or resident of, any of the following countries: Cuba, Iran, North Korea, Sudan, or Syria;
I agree to comply with all applicable U.S. export laws and host country import laws.

On 2014-10-02 10:36, DJViking wrote:
>
> Apparently SUSE is still subject to US laws.
> I got this when I wanted to download the SLES bash fix
>
>>
>> U.S. Export Laws And Regulations
>> United States export laws and regulations apply to the use or
>> distribution of this Novell product. This product may not be downloaded,
>> exported or redistributed in any form in or to Cuba, Iran, North Korea,
>> Sudan, or Syria or to residents or nationals of any of the
>> aforementioned countries.

That’s a sore point.

I know some Cuban people, certainly not government officials, which do
use Linux in their environment, with great difficulty. I know some that
have email but no web access, meaning that they can’t reach technical
documentation web pages. Updates are very difficult. Sometimes they get
the distribution via some traveller that brings the dvd. I have sent
some one files (patches or something), in email, breaking them in 1 Mb
chunks, in order not to overload his account; files that he would be
able to get with no restriction except for the fact that he has no web
access.

And the sore point is that, those that do have occasional web access
they can not register on Bugzilla! They are denied. Free software is
not free for them.

I can understand that Novell heeds the embargo, it is a company based in
the USA. But not openSUSE.


Cheers / Saludos,

Carlos E. R.
(from 13.1 x86_64 “Bottle” at Telcontar)

Hi,

First argument: Being the company in the UK it is Far Worst then being in the USA in what regards illegal and anti-Constitutional data collection.
Just look around for the Snowden comments on that and you will realize that in the UK not even a court order is necessary to make Anti-Constitutional data collections.
I think the same applies for any Legal requirement to have a Software Bugged from Factory, not to mention the possibility of not packaging some encryption Software.
The Stasi-like State surveillance laws are getting bigger all the time.

About taxes I would strongly hope SuSE will go the route of Offshoring and choosing a Low to no Taxation countries, like Ubuntu did on the Isle of Man.
Everyone should fight this Statism we live in by first and foremost Massive Tax Evasion.

Best regards.

This seems to be getting political to me. And I’m not sure our forum should be seen to advocate illegal acts (tax evasion is illegal, certainly in UK).