New to the forum, although I’ve been fiddling with PPC formatted linux flavors for a number of years, now mostly ubuntu based, like LM. Recently I and others discovered that LM is not letting “sudo” work to “dist-upgrade” kernel updates, something that I’ve done routinely for quite awhile, and I posted about that on their forum. A poster there mentioned “GenToo” as “the system to use” and yesterday I tested a LiveDVD of that system, but I found that I couldn’t even set the system time from “live” disk . . . so I felt GT was “resisting” me. I dug through my stack of iso DVD’s and I found a liveDVD of OpenSuse 13.1 which I had at the time figured out how to select the Gnome 3 DE . . . and I booted it up on my '12 Mac Pro . . . and, I could set the time (basic stuff actually happened, etc).
So I spent some time this morning reading through the OSuse FAQ’s and everything seems pretty thorough; but I still have a few questions. Although I could use the LiveDVD I have now to run an install I see that there are now new flavors of OpenSuse to choose from; would it be easier to start fresh with a new system or just as easy to install the 13.1 and then upgrade? Part of my problem is my internet connection is “slow” and a 4.7GB download would likely be 5+ hours of downloading . . . very slow. Also in my history of running linux on Macs is that for some reason KDE didn’t seem to work well; and when I downloaded the GNOME edition of OSuse 13 I was looking for the GNOME “floating feet” screensaver, but at the time and yesterday that screensaver didn’t seem to be part of the system–so I have no attachment to the GNOME if there is no “feets.” I’m using MATE DE on LM, and I like MATE, although one reason for installing OSuse would be to get some variety . . . which might be found in the “Gecko Linux” options??? Any comments about the other DE options would be welcomed; from the FAQ it only showed the installer offering KDE & GNOME for the LEAP install . . . .
Finally, the main question, after reading through a number of FAQ’s and wiki’s I see that the Terminal commands for OpenSuse are different than the ubuntu based systems that I have used previously and have installed now as part of a triple boot system. I had planned on splitting the partition that has the LM root filesystem on it into two, and then hoped to simply flag the existing home partition that I have for LM and use that as a shared home, but from reading a recent post here where the OP was saying he couldn’t find his home . . . in their case one version of OpenSuse was formatted as “btrfs” and the other as “ext4” . . . but my LM root & home are both “ext4” . . . is it possible to share the home file system “cross-platform” between OpenSuse & LM? Or, better to set up a whole other ~50GB partition exclusively for OpenSuse and then run the install on “automatic” . . . rather than “expert partitioner”??? I have run a fair number of multi-boot installs and usually have to use “install manually” to set up the partitions . . . . But, question is whether the different command terms in the Terminal between LM & OpenSuse would create some kind of problem, or, no worries, it’s all linux under the hood . . . filesystems are compatible and they can be tossed together and they would “play nicely with others”??
Current version is 42.2 (Yes big jump in numbering and it is called leap) upgrading could be done but it really saves little in bandwidth since just about all things have changed. 13.1 is out of support so no updates
Which terminal commands? Most commands are just Linux no matter what flavor. sudo works differently out of the box and there is a root user
You can share home but it is probably best to to use a different user name. This keeps you from mixing config files that may come from different versions of software. Also there may be differences in the UID (user ID) numbering which can be a pain to resolve.
Currently Leap does not ave “Live” DVD images. There is a offshoot call Gecko that come on a live system. But last I checked it still was at Leap 42.1. Also it is a little smaller since you get an ISO with just one desktop on it by default. About 900 meg again last I looked. update just checked Gecko now come with 42.2 base
There is a rolling version (ie cutting edge) called Tumbleweed which I believe still has a live version But there are lots of updates and may not be suitable for low bandwidth.
Appreciate the reply and the details . . . I usually use “LTS” versions, as even though I’m in linux for sh**s and giggles, the SID/bleeding edge versions are beyond my skillset to deal with. Thanks for the thoughts about using another user ID, I may go that way . . . I like things to go “easy” the first time. I do like trying out a system with a “live” system, especially if things have changed quite a bit from OS 13 . . . .
What about the standard formatting? Is that “ext4”?? for OpenSuse or something else??
As far as “sudo” goes . . . in ubuntu and LM to “update/upgrade” they use “apt” or something like “sudo apt-get update” to scan the repos before upgrading; wheras Opensuse seems to use “su” to invoke admin, and then “zypper patch” to do basic system upgrades . . . very different command sets. From memory I recall that maybe it was Debian that also uses “su” to get to root, and then you run the “apt” options . . . buntu and such just use “sudo” to invoke root user commands . . . . Not that one is easier or better, but seemingly not similar???
Install LEAP 42.2, fresh install. It is very stable (Tumbleweed is our rolling release).
The default in the installer is btrfs, but you can change that, and I suggest for now you use the familiar ext4. I use it for root & home partitions.
As for desktops, multiple choices in openSUSE. The two main ones at install are KDE Plasma5 and Gnome, but also included are other desktops, and I believe MATE is available, just install it and switch after installing LEAP. Plenty friendly users on this forum to guide you with desktop choices.
Thanks also to you for your insights; appreciate letting me know what the default formatting is, yep, I use ext4. I’m assuming by “fresh install” that you mean not trying to upgrade from 13.1 . . . rather than referring to the possibility of sharing the home folder I have for what is just LM right now?
But, yeah, the DE decision isn’t too serious, in the past I have had multiple DEs installed . . . but, apparently that can cause problems on some package overlaps . . . on my PPC units I keep it to XFCE & LXDE . . . but, on my newer computer I like a bit more eye splash from my DE . . . and one of the reasons I do use MATE is because they do offer the “Floating Feet of GNOME” screensaver . . . very amusing to see those GNOME feet floating across the screen . . . . Might have to check that out via Gecko MATE and see what’s up wit dat . . . ???
. . . rather than referring to the possibility of sharing the home folder I have for what is just LM right now?
You can do the install either way, by preserving and sharing the home folder, or by having a new separate /home.
I think you are probably safer having a new separate /home, personally, as gogalthorp pointed out, can avoid some conflicts and mysteries that way.
on my PPC units I keep it to XFCE & LXDE
… both available in openSUSE.
the “Floating Feet of GNOME” screensaver . . . very amusing to see those GNOME feet floating across the screen . . . . Might have to check that out via Gecko MATE and see what’s up wit dat . . . ???
I believe – not certain – that you need to install screensavers specifically after you have installed openSUSE newer versions, do not know with other distros, and I only use KDE at the moment, so I also do not know much about the other desktops.
Let me tell you about my setup, which is designed to address some of the issues you raise. One of the main issues is that configurations are stored in home and some DE’s have become famous for stepping on each others toes. Another issue is upgrades, if home is on its own partition the OS can be upgraded without trashing the current configuration. The last issue is protecting data.
I have an SSD and a HHD, both 500gig. All data is in a partition on the HHD, and the swap partition is there too. On the SSD there are three 20gig partitions for three OS’s. In an extended partition are three 10gig partitions for matching homes, and the extra space is currently being used for backups. 10gigs is generous for home but I’ve run out of space in the past with large downloads, which go into /home/Downloads.
I use the same username across the board which makes it easy to mount one of the other home partitions and fiddle with it.
More than the details, I hope you can see the logic of the setup.
Mike
Thanks for the thoughts; I have yet to get into the SSD + HHD combi/hybrid issues . . . and some time back I was under the impression that there could only be a small number of regular partitions, and then the rest had to be “extended” . . . but then I found that with newer HDs there can be an unlimited number of regular partitions, so I don’t know the ups/downs of using extended . . . versus “regular,” etc.
But, I do understand that you set up three separate home partitions . . . using the same user name for each of them . . . and that avoids problems with overlaps on config files . . . . I would agree that these days 10 GB for a home folder would probably be “low” . . . even for liveDVDs the size of them has grown to several GBs . . . wouldn’t take long to fill it up.
@et al:
OK, I’ve gotten some general ideas, many thanks; I’ll have to take some time to download some of the options and test them out, and then run an install . . . see how that goes . . . and I’ll post back with the “situation” when I get there . . . .
Hi
Don’t get confused, if your using Legacy/BIOS to boot you will need to user ‘dos’ type format 3+extended partition (up to 15?), if using UEFI to boot (hardware dependent), then you have to use ‘gpt’ and a small ~260MB efi (type ef00) vfat partition and then up to 127 more partitions… You could use hybrid, but that is a bit more work but doable…
Ah, OK, on the MPro that is “UEFI” . . . I think a few years back linux wasn’t doing “EFI” and I needed to use rEFInd to get linux systems booted; but, now linux is EFI fluent . . . so, very good, 127 partitions is probably enough for me . . . I like having “space” to play with . . . .
n_s
PS: BTW there has been an “error” when trying to click the links from the email notifications, twice today; whereas yesterday no problem? “Corrupted data”??? is cited problem on the error window . . . everything “looks” OK in the email . . . . I might have been logged out??? would that break the link connection; that hasn’t been an issue on other forums I use . . . .
Hi
Ahh, a MacBook, I have a MacBook 3,1 (2007) with osX and openSUSE Leap 42.2 on it, to boot into osX I just use the option button, else it uses efi to boot (no bootcamp/refind) and works a treat.
If multibooting then stick with pure efi then and gpt.
The SSD and HDD are two hard drives and the fact that one is SSD and the other HHD is irrelevant to this issue. Having two drives is just another way to keep things in their own space, like operating systems on the SSD and data on the HDD.
The extended partition is a feature of a legacy system vs UEFI and irrelevant to the issue here. If the motherboard supports UEFI then that’s another learning opportunity.
Ok, got it now, wasn’t following the fact that when you first said “data” you mean the “home” folder(s) are on the HD, and the OS filesystems are on the SSD . . . I get it now, I think. I see the thinking . . . and, at some point I may get there, but I just have one large HD in the MP at this point.
Here’s some more clarification, I don’t have a crayon but I’ll try to draw pictures. My two drives are known to Linux as sda and sdb. The partitions are sda1, sda2, etc. sda4 is the extended partition that holds 5-8.
sda1 - Mint os
sda2 - SUSE Tumbleweed os
sda3 - LMDE os
sda5 - home for Mint
sda6 - home for Tumbleweed
sda7 - home for LMDE
sda8 - backup space
sdb1 - data
sdb swap
As you can see I can upgrade, reinstall, or trash an operating system without impacting the configs in home or the data. The partition numbers are set when created and awkward to change so you might want to create your structure first.
Mike
OK, got it . . . so all the homes also are on sda . . . .
Idle question for a rainy day, what constitutes and resides in “data”?? Documents?? Tunes?? Anything outside of immediate “home” files???
I’m just asking because over the years most linux systems have developed “issues” such that for the most part “nuke/pave” have been the ultimate solution . . . all is wiped clean and begun freshly, nothing survives . . . therefore nothing is kept, it’s all a rolling “tumbleweed” of freshness that is here today and probably erased in the near future . . . .
I’m thinking that my next laptop will be a PC rather than Mac, that means I’m looking for a stable linux system to use as front line system for it other than windows; so now these tips to preserve critical documents are indeed helpful . . . .
Sharing a home partition is ok as long as you use different user names so you have a different home directory thus personal settings won’t get stepped on. Some start UID at 500 and openSUSE starts UID at 1000. This can be a stumbling block so best keep home directories separate but they can all be on one partition.
Multiboot (quad os) Laptop
NAME MAJ:MIN RM SIZE RO TYPE MOUNTPOINT
sda 8:0 0 111.8G 0 disk
├─sda1 8:1 0 260M 0 part /boot/efi
├─sda2 8:2 0 40G 0 part /
├─sda3 8:3 0 40G 0 part
└─sda4 8:4 0 31.5G 0 part /data
sdb 8:16 0 111.8G 0 disk
├─sdb1 8:17 0 300M 0 part
├─sdb2 8:18 0 100M 0 part
├─sdb3 8:19 0 128M 0 part
├─sdb4 8:20 0 62.9G 0 part
├─sdb5 8:21 0 450M 0 part
├─sdb6 8:22 0 8G 0 part [SWAP]
└─sdb7 8:23 0 40G 0 part
Desktop
NAME MAJ:MIN RM SIZE RO TYPE MOUNTPOINT
sda 8:0 0 298.1G 0 disk
└─sda1 8:1 0 298.1G 0 part /afp
sdb 8:16 0 931.5G 0 disk
└─sdb1 8:17 0 931.5G 0 part /backup
sdc 8:32 0 119.2G 0 disk
├─sdc1 8:33 0 512M 0 part /boot
├─sdc2 8:34 0 1K 0 part
├─sdc5 8:37 0 40G 0 part /
├─sdc6 8:38 0 70.8G 0 part /data
└─sdc7 8:39 0 8G 0 part [SWAP]
sdd 8:48 0 465.8G 0 disk
├─sdd1 8:49 0 300G 0 part /var/lib/libvirt
└─sdd2 8:50 0 165.8G 0 part /repositories
Server
NAME MAJ:MIN RM SIZE RO TYPE MOUNTPOINT
sda 8:0 0 698.7G 0 disk
├─sda1 8:1 0 298.1G 0 part
│ └─md127 9:127 0 298.1G 0 raid1 /data
├─sda2 8:2 0 260M 0 part /boot/efi
├─sda3 8:3 0 40G 0 part /
├─sda4 8:4 0 8G 0 part [SWAP]
└─sda5 8:5 0 352.3G 0 part /kvm
sdb 8:16 0 298.1G 0 disk
└─sdb1 8:17 0 298.1G 0 part
└─md127 9:127 0 298.1G 0 raid1 /data
In my /data partition I use softlinks to things like downloads, music, videos, pictures etc off to the $HOME directory plus configuration files like ~/.bashrc ~/.face ~/.icons ~/.fonts etc.
So I finally found some time to run the installer for Gecko MATE, and other than an error that wouldn’t resolve the install seemed to go very fast and seems to be “OK.” I used a separate partition for the file system and I piggybacked the home user in the same partition that I already had for LM MATE–different user name; and shared the “swap.”
The error that would not resolve or seem to present any options to resolve it was for “flagging” the FAT32 filesystem with an “esp” flag and using mount point “/boot/efi” . . . which showed up when I forgot to set that and clicked “next” . . . so I went back and set the mount point to “/boot/efi” . . . but there weren’t any listings for “esp” in the flags . . . which again error-ed out a few times until I flagged it “bios_grub” as I used to do for my LM Intel Mac installs . . . before I figured out how to install for “EFI.” And I think “bios_grub” also brought an error, so I might have unchecked it . . . and that again error-ed, etc. I finally decide to “go for broke” and run the install, and in the pre-install summary was still listed the “bios_grub” flag . . . I ran the install and it completed probably the fastest of any linux install I’ve done . . . which is a fair number. On reboot we went to the OpenSUSE green Grub page . . . and in we went to the Gecko . . . started setting it . . . it all seemed to work OK. I later used the green GRUB page to load LM, that was fine.
Couple questions: After the reboot I ran “zypper patch” and got 100 MB or so of updates, saw that a “libsensors” package was listed . . . and then I ran “zypper update” and it found a few other things, but also found “9 packages that are held back” . . . some of those file names had “xxx-bad” in the name. In ubuntu based flavors I have used the “apt-get dist-upgrade” command to catch the “held back” packages or kernel upgrades; I’m not used to this “zypper” approach . . . is there another command to run to try to get these “held backs” or, are they “held back” because they are indeed “bad” for OpenSUSE?? Is there a preferred order to running the “zypper” commands “patch” or “update”?? Or, essentially they are similar? Again, in the ubuntu flavors we run “apt-get update” to review the repositories, and then “apt-get upgrade” to get the packages . . . seems like the “zypper” command is perhaps doing both??? I keep my terminal chores pretty basic, so I’m just wondering if there is another recommended command to pull kernel updates and/or “held backs”??
Also, in the ubuntu world there was need for concern about “fan control” issues when running on Macintosh Intel computers; LM seems to be saying they have that one covered with good temperature control packages as part of their project. I saw a post on this forum mentioning “Fan control” . . . I don’t do a whole lot of processor intensive stuff, mostly GUI fiddling . . . does seeing the “libsensors” package mean that there are some basic “fan control” packages in place? Or, nope, I need to get that one covered much better?? Again, this is '12 Mac Pro . . . so far nothing dramatic seems to be going on with basic use of Gecko . . . no fans blowing like mad, computer doesn’t seem to have hot spots like my '09 MBookPro did get with earlier versions of LM . . . forgettaaboutit?? Or, smother it with fan control apps ASAP???
You must boot the installer in EFI mode if you want to install EFI boot If you boot in legacy you get MBR boot and not EFI boot partition. If you boot EFI you create or use existing an EFI boot partition mounted as /efi/boot by default. If you boot the installer you do not get an EFI boot partition. NOTE do not mix boot methods if multiple booting you can not chain between OS using different methods and you have to use the UEFI boot menu to chose OS.
Note I’m assuming Gecko has not significantly changed the installer which I doubt they have.
Note that Gecko has changed the default update behavior. I believe they turned off install recommended packages by default. That can be changed in Yast software management
openSUSE is not Ubuntu. Don’t expect it to work exactly the same