My appreciations of the retail opensuse's DVD

English Soapbox
#1

( Following of this thread: Boxed Version DVD packages content sync - openSUSE Forums )

Just received my Boxed version yesterday, i was so excited that i left the office earlier than usual (everybody looked at me weirdly ). So i ran to my house to install my new toy and starting play with it (didn’t download yet cuz’ i was waiting for my order).

So, Powered on my HP dv6211, inserted the dual layer DVD, and rhaaaaa, it was there: the boot-up screen with the beautiful green.

The first thing i noticed is that comparing to the screenshots available on multiple places, my screen resolution was a little bit tiny (i think 800x600). Didn’t get this issue with for example the Kde4-beta2-live-CD (the resolution was set at 1280x800 directly from the boot screen).

This minor issue didn’t attenuate my enthusiasm, So i continued with the installation. I will not detail here the details of my install: All hardware were detected and I choosed to install KDE3, X86_64 system; installed various pieces of software (development, some games, etc…).

After about 35 mins and a reboot, i logged into my new system. First of all, backuped various datas from my old “/home/hotus” directory (Movies, Music, Documents, Games, Softwares, …) and deleted everything inside.

After configuring the desktop to my taste, i decided to give a try to the installed softwares. The verdict: i was very disappointed:( ! My main complaint is that the content of the DVD which is supposed to include Non-OSS and OSS packages is far from being complete and usable out of the box for a begginer. I paid to have a full system installable and ready to use everywhere! Most of my computers are not connected to internet so, i expected that with a purchased version of OpenSuse, i’d also get a full-featured system!
So here are my recriminations:

  • Multimedia:

    • Amarok shipped with gstreamer backend!!! Where is the Xine Backend?? Anyway, WHERE IS XINE AT ALL?? :mad:
    • There is no mysql support in amarok ( that’s what i used to store my collection)
    • Kaffeine doesn’t play any of my videos (Avi, 3gp, mp4, …) i don’t wantuse realplayer (it doesn’t fully work at well )
    • I understand that there can’t be win codecs packed with the distro, so i’ll install manually w32codecs; that’s not a big deal.
    • libdvdcss missing !! :mad: (but, i paid for the patent stuffs )

  • Networking:

    • kppp : pain in ze ass to get this working ! an obscure message about the root who don’t have rights on the software.

  • Development:

    • Kdevelop : M-I-S-S-I-N-G !!!

  • Documentation:

    • I expected to have a full documentation printed with deep details on all part of the system, instead of the start-up guide i’ve found in the box (perhaps misunderstood for me when purchasing).

I’ve fought with these kinds of issues till’ 1:00 AM and i am very very disappointed with the product i bought.

Anyway, i’ve also found in the printed doc the details about the content of the retail version: There are supposed to be 2 type of DVD, the dual layer dvd with release version, and a snapshot of ftp.opensuse.org. This answered my previous preoccupation about the content.

Sadly I Only get the dual layer dvd !

i’ve lost my patience and stopped my investigations. I’m sure that there are other niches where problems persists.

What is the benefit (apart support for the distro) to buy a retail version of opensuse :confused:

#2

Not quite - libdvdcss is still illegal in many countries - no amount of money will change that fact (unless you bribe the politicians like MPAA/RIAA etc.)

Isn’t that a reason enough? I’ve bought (literally) hundreds and hundreds of SuSE boxes in the past years even when I didn’t really need to - I could’ve just installed it and shipped the machines out but I wanted to give a little back in order to see the product develop.

#3

Oh and i forgot something, nvidia driver (manually installed) systematically refuse to bring up composition . boring

#4

The only thing one can complain about is that more packages should be on the retail DVD. Only 6.4 GB are used so there could be some more packages on the media. Maye someone with a slow internet connection buys the boxed version because he hopes for a better software choice on the retail edition. An extra DVD like in 10.3 on my opinion is not needed.

Btw. kdevelop is included in the (german) boxed version.

#5

> What is the benefit (apart support for the distro) to buy a retail
> version of opensuse :confused:

Supporting the project financially so that there will be an OS12? :slight_smile:

I agree though that Linux distros in general need to come up with a
comprehensive well thought out distribution media and stick with it once
they find that happy place. There will never be 1 configuration fits all,
but hopefully they can find something that is tolerable to most.

I understand the desire to keep costs low and minimize environmental impact
as well. Maybe they need a system where you can subscribe for a nominal fee
and they burn each major release for you which you are then free to copy
and distribute. They could also ship you any new documentation if you
opt-in for that service. Sounds kinda cool actually.
I think I’d sign on for that…BUT…they’d need to ship the new versions
PRIOR to them hitting the ftp servers. Kind of a subscribers bonus. :^)

#6

You are right Monex! Why just put 6.4GB of softwares inside the DVD. I’ve got the english version of the box, and i bought it just for the reasons you mentionned before (slow connection). But now, i need to figure out how to get my Pc plugged where is a high speed and open connection. Return to the start !

#7

Who said anything about ‘libdvdcss2’, that’s just an illegal (in not so civil areas of the world) hack.

…look, when you purchase Windows XXX (ugh, I hate using MS as an anology) a portion of that money goes to pay for licenses on patented technology namely multimedia. PowerDVD or LinDVD could be a part of the retail vers cost along w/ the Fluendo codecs for multimedia playback.

#8

Actually Windows XP for example will not play DVD content out of the box because it lacks an MPEG-2 decoder.

The original poster asked why libdvdcss was not included - I replied because it was illegal - I did not take a stance on the possibility of including other 3rd party solution.

#9

hotus wrote:

> After configuring the desktop to my taste, i decided to give a try to
> the installed softwares. The verdict: i was very disappointed:( ! My
> main complaint is that the content of the DVD which is supposed to
> include Non-OSS and OSS packages is far from being complete and usable
> out of the box for a begginer. I paid to have a full system installable
> and ready to use everywhere! Most of my computers are not connected to
> internet so, i expected that with a purchased version of OpenSuse, i’d
> also get a full-featured system!

You did. Just add the community repositories and and you will have access to
everything. You don’t need to be connected to use openSUSE, of course, but
there is only so much space on one dual layer dvd. It’s unreasonable to
expect all the available software to come on one dvd. It’s also
unreasonable to be able to expect to install not just the operating system
but every possible package without using internet access.

> So here are my recriminations:
> - Multimedia:Viewable with Any Browser: Accessible Site Design Guide
> * Amarok shipped with gstreamer backend!!!

Of course.

> Where is the Xine
> Backend?? Anyway, WHERE IS XINE AT ALL?? :mad:

It’s on Packman, where it’s been for the last three distributions. If you
don’t like it that Novell is unwilling to expose themselves to the
financial penalties that could be imposed by your courts because of
ridiculous patent law in the US, please get a government elected that
doesn’t allow software patents.

> * There is no mysql support in amarok ( that’s what i used to store
> my collection)

Sure there is. Just install the Packman version of Amarok and all the
necessary files are added. Start mysql and configure Amarok.

> * Kaffeine doesn’t play any of my videos (Avi, 3gp, mp4, …) i
> don’t wantuse realplayer (it doesn’t fully work at well )
> * I understand that there can’t be win codecs packed with the
> distro, so i’ll install manually w32codecs; that’s not a big deal.
> * libdvdcss missing !! :mad: (but, i paid for the patent stuffs )

No, you didn’t. Novell can’t sell what they don’t own. The world is a
dangerous place for corporations that don’t protect themselves by not
giving you stuff they don’t own. Personally, I don’t agree with software
patents at all, so I work to get people elected to change those laws, but I
don’t blame corporations for obeying the laws that exist.

> - Documentation:
> * I expected to have a full documentation printed with deep details
> on all part of the system, instead of the start-up guide i’ve found in
> the box (perhaps misunderstood for me when purchasing).

The last boxed set I got a full set of manuals with was SuSe 9.3. Yes, it’s
annoying. Later versions have only come with the installation guide. You
can,however access all the documentation at
http://en.opensuse.org/Documentation#Official_Novell_Documentation

>
> I’ve fought with these kinds of issues till’ 1:00 AM and i am very very
> disappointed with the product i bought.

Because of the various legal issues it is simply not possible for Novell to
give you software they don’t have rights to. Fortunately fixing the
multimedia problems you describe doesn’t take very long, at least partly
because of some excellent instruction sheets. Start with “Hacking openSuse
10.3” (instructions worked for me on 10.3 and 11.0) so that you download
the right software, and you’ll be able to view dvds, listen to mp3s, etc.
No, it IS a Pain In The Ass to have to do this, but you have only to blame
mostly the US (and other) governments for the legal environment Novell and
other Linux distributors find themselves in.

This means we have to find workarounds. There are good guides for multimedia
installs, for adding mysql to amarok, for making dvds play, etc.Google is
your friend.

Stick with it and almost all the things you want to work, will work. The
openSUSE groups are great for a great many answers - look in the archive
for your particular problem.

Because I maintain 5 different computers, I’ve installed versions of
openSUSE fairly often, as I don’t like to get more than a couple of
versions behind. On version 11.0, I can get the basic install, plus updates
in about 40 minutes. Add another ten minutes and all that’s left is
configuring my email.

Today I needed to reinstall Windows XP on one of my computers that I keep
for older software that has no Linux version (yet). Two hours into the
install I had just finished all the updates (which all had to be
downloaded) and I hadn’t even installed any actual programs yet!

–
bob@rsmits.ca (Robert Smits, Ladysmith BC)

“I’m not one of those who think Bill Gates is the devil. I simply suspect
that if Microsoft ever met up with the devil, it wouldn’t need an
interpreter.” - Nicholas Petreley

#10

That’s 6.8 GB of compressed & imaged software; all expanded, there is 16GB on the dual layered DVD:)

#11

But some software is still missing on the retail DVD which was part of the 10.0, 10.2 and 10.3 retail DVD, for example scribus and phpmayadmin. Overall it’s still ok for me as long as the boxed version does not only contain an network install cd :wink:

As a compensation the box has an extra DVD with video training for gimp, opensuse 11 and openoffice. Maybe i can get some hint’s for gimp :cool: (Sadly this is only part of the german version).

#12

Why those differences between English and german Version???:mad:

#13

Thx For your reply Robert,
Actually, i’ve got a quite satisfying installation; installed manually additional features/software i need. I’ll stick with openSUSE of course, but for future releases, i won’t purchase again a boxed set .

On another side, as, the compression algorithm on DVD is now so powerful, why don’t take advantage of that? I mean, if there can be additional usable space on dvd, why not add some other stuff??

#14

They used the videos produced from video2brain and as far as I know the used videos are currently not translated into English. I think that is the reason for the difference.