How to make openSUSE free (as in freedom)?

English Install/Boot/Login
1

Hi,

I have been listening to some of the speeches of Mr.Stallman and on fsf.org I read:

openSUSE offers a repository of nonfree software. This is an instance of how “open” is weaker than “free”.

Running “zypper lr” I see this:

i7:~ # zypper lr

#  | Alias                              | Name                               | Enabled | GPG Check | Refresh
---+------------------------------------+------------------------------------+---------+-----------+--------
 1 | Google-Chrome                      | Google-Chrome                      | Yes     | (r ) Yes  | Yes    
 2 | Virtualization                     | Virtualization                     | Yes     | (r ) Yes  | Yes    
 3 | download.nvidia.com-opensuse       | nVidia Graphics Drivers            | Yes     | (r ) Yes  | Yes    
 4 | download.opensuse.org-13.2-non-oss | Update Repository (Non-Oss)        | Yes     | (r ) Yes  | Yes    
 5 | download.opensuse.org-non-oss      | Main Repository (NON-OSS)          | Yes     | (r ) Yes  | Yes    
 6 | download.opensuse.org-oss          | Main Repository (OSS)              | Yes     | (r ) Yes  | Yes    
 7 | download.opensuse.org-update       | Main Update Repository             | Yes     | (r ) Yes  | Yes    
 8 | repo-debug                         | openSUSE-13.2-Debug                | No      | ----      | Yes    
 9 | repo-debug-update                  | openSUSE-13.2-Update-Debug         | No      | ----      | Yes    
10 | repo-debug-update-non-oss          | openSUSE-13.2-Update-Debug-Non-Oss | No      | ----      | Yes    
11 | repo-source                        | openSUSE-13.2-Source               | No      | ----      | Yes

I suppose the NON-OSS repos are the ones which make this distro “non-free”.

I wonder:

  1. What will happen if one disables the NON-OSS repos (4 and 5)? Would that automatically remove the packages installed from that repos? If not - how should they be removed?
  2. If those packages from “non-free” repos are removed - how will that affect the system as a whole? Not sure if that is the correct command but I tried running “zypper packages -i download.opensuse.org-13.2-non-oss” and it lists a great deal of packages.
  3. Is there anything actual to worry about when using software from the non-oss repos?

I am still fairly new to this system, so I hope I am not asking something stupid. :slight_smile:

2

No, it won’t remove the packages.

Before you disable, go into Yast Software Management, and select the “Repository” view. Then click on those repos. It will tell you what you have installed from there. You can then delete them if you want to.

When I check that, I see flash, unrar and gstreamer-fluendo-mp3. There’s actually not a lot there from the non-free repos.

But I really wonder why you would be concerned about that. You have the Nvidia repos, and those too count as non-free. And you added those yourself, probably to get better graphics support.

3

Hi
If you fire up YaST software management and in the dropdown select ‘repositories’ and you can see what packages are offered in the non-oss repository. If you don’t want flash or play mp3’s then you should be fine… just remember to remove before your disable the repositories.

I don’t use the non-oss repo with Tumbleweed. mainly because flash is a pain… I do use fluendo codecs though.

4

Thank you guys for the quick reply! I didn’t know about the “Repository” view in YaST but now I do. Very useful.

Quite right. I see the same + AdobeICCProfiles.

But I really wonder why you would be concerned about that. You have the Nvidia repos, and those too count as non-free. And you added those yourself, probably to get better graphics support.

I think I am not quite concerned after your explanations as in the non-oss repos indeed I see only a few packages installed. As for nVidia non-free drivers - well… I guess that is just as unavoidable as using Google.

How do you play videos on the web without flash installed? Is there any free substitute you could recommend?

5

On Sat 11 Jul 2015 05:16:01 PM CDT, heyjoe wrote:

Thank you guys for the quick reply! I didn’t know about the “Repository”
view in YaST but now I do. Very useful.

nrickert;2719213 Wrote:
>
> When I check that, I see flash, unrar and gstreamer-fluendo-mp3.
> There’s actually not a lot there from the non-free repos.
>
Quite right. I see the same + AdobeICCProfiles.
> But I really wonder why you would be concerned about that. You have
> the Nvidia repos, and those too count as non-free. And you added
> those yourself, probably to get better graphics support.
I think I am not quite concerned after your explanations as in the
non-oss repos indeed I see only a few packages installed. As for nVidia
non-free drivers - well… I guess that is just as unavoidable as using
Google.

malcolmlewis;2719214 Wrote:
>
> I don’t use the non-oss repo with Tumbleweed. mainly because flash is
> a pain… I do use fluendo codecs though.
How do you play videos on the web without flash installed? Is there any
free substitute you could recommend?

Hi
Hopefully they use html5, else don’t worry about it… their loss not
mine… :wink:

Note that’s only on Tumbleweed, I do use flash (on SLED), but like to
see what works and doesn’t.

–
Cheers Malcolm °¿° LFCS, SUSE Knowledge Partner (Linux Counter #276890)
SUSE Linux Enterprise Desktop 12 GNOME 3.10.1 Kernel
3.12.43-52.6-default If you find this post helpful and are logged into
the web interface, please show your appreciation and click on the star
below… Thanks!

6

On 2015-07-11 18:56, heyjoe wrote:

> I suppose the NON-OSS repos are the ones which make this distro
> “non-free”.

And Nvidia, and perhaps packman. I’m unsure if listening or watching
videos that somebody else encoded using proprietary codecs, but which
you play using reverse-engineered free software, is considered proper or
not by Mr Stallman.

> I wonder:
>
>
> - What will happen if one disables the NON-OSS repos (4 and 5)? Would
> that automatically remove the packages installed from that repos? If
> not - how should they be removed?

You also would need to remove all the packages that were installed from
that (those) repos.

> - If those packages from “non-free” repos are removed - how will that
> affect the system as a whole?

If you use those particular packages, a lot. Do you browse videos on
internet? Then you need flash. Or don’t see videos… your choice.
Unless the site uses html5.

Yes, there is a free flash payer (pepper?), but it is very green yet.

> - Is there anything actual to worry about when using software from the
> non-oss repos?

Worry? No, unless you take that political stance. Up to you to worry or
not :wink:

It is a very difficult personal choice, if you want to avoid all
proprietary software. What Mr Stallman does is admirable.

> I am still fairly new to this system, so I hope I am not asking
> something stupid. :slight_smile:

No, many of us ask ourselves those questions at some moment or other :slight_smile:

–
Cheers / Saludos,

Carlos E. R.

(from 13.1 x86_64 “Bottle” (Minas Tirith))

7

Some videos are in HTML5 format But if you dig down you will find that the actual codecs are not “FREE” as defined by Stallmen. He has a very ridged view. However openSUSE ships with only open source programs. But the non-oss repo is set up by default and several thing may come in on the first update. If you do the update manually you can stop those programs you don’t want. The thing is that most people want MP3 and 4 and other popular codecs to consume media since very few things are published in OSS formats. Since many many web pages rely on flash that is included in the updates. Many things may be brought in because they are recommended by some package you have installed. You can turn that off in Yast so as not to be tainted with non open source programs lol!

You do have to work at it to get a pure OS and it means that you also forgo many things that you may want. Most “social media” relies on some form of closed source. Most video and sound media also.

8

It is my understanding that pepper flash comes from adobe, built to google specifications (for chrome).

I think there’s a “gnash” as a free flash implementation. I’ve never tried it.

9

Thanks everyone for commenting on this!

Exactly what I have been thinking. Basically browsing the Internet means using tons of non-free software, being “securely” tracked according to some self-excusatory privacy policies and all the rest of it. It’s a total mess :slight_smile:

10

The non-oss repo has very few packages, mostly free as in free beer Adobe products.
The bigger problem is software patents, xvid, x264, faac(d), lame etc. are free as in free speech GPL’ed codec, but because of some countries software patents opensuse does not carry them not even in the non-oss repo, unfortunately most html5 media is mp4 with h264 video and aac audio, without the above packages you are missing out on a lot your OS can do.
So while you can probobly drop adobe flash for youtube and use html5 you still need free but possibly patented codecs.

ps. Seeing your repo list you definitely should add packman’s repository, you won’t be able to play embeded mp4 videos with firefox without it, or watch any video (exception being ogm and webm) or listen to any audio (ogg is free), you can add packman from yast’s list of community repositories or with zypper

zypper ar -f http://ftp.gwdg.de/pub/linux/misc/packman/suse/openSUSE_13.2/ packman

ps the above packman url is from the opensuse wiki, packman has a lot of mirrors for a mirror near you see here
http://packman.links2linux.org/mirrors

ps.ps. pepper flash is still propitiatory the thing is google has access to the code and does some tweaking, the replacement for flash is mozilla shumway but that is written in javascript and has some more work to do before it is ready for regular use.

11

On 2015-07-11 20:56, nrickert wrote:
>
> robin_listas;2719222 Wrote:
>> Yes, there is a free flash payer (pepper?), but it is very green yet.
>
> It is my understanding that pepper flash comes from adobe, built to
> google specifications (for chrome).
>
> I think there’s a “gnash” as a free flash implementation. I’ve never
> tried it.

Ah, maybe that’s the one I was thinking of, and confused the name, as I
use neither of them.

–
Cheers / Saludos,

Carlos E. R.

(from 13.1 x86_64 “Bottle” (Minas Tirith))

12

There are good free alternatives to mp3 such as ogg and flac. I tend to prefer them if I can. For example I can rip to Flac and get lossless quality (ok it uses much more space but storage is cheap). If I download I try to go for ogg or flac where available and ask for it if it isn’t. Also the Nouveau drivers (which I think are open source) are fairly good for most things including 3d desktop effects. Then there’s my Samsung printer… grrr… if I want to print then unfortunately that is proprietary only and although I don’t use a laptop I think many wireless drivers are the same. So there are some things that are easy to do to support the open source way and some not so easy. I have found that disabling Flash hasn’t marred my experience on the web too much… Html5 seems to be better supported now; which is good considering how bad and vulnerable Flash is.

13

and don’t forget that Linux kernel has blobs and propietary software inside… Time ago I read how to install Linux Libre on openSUSE, here you have the link

14

Where on earth did you get this idea? It most certainly does not.

15

On 2015-07-14 15:26, victorhck wrote:
>
> and don’t forget that Linux kernel has blobs and propietary software
> inside…

Do you have evidence for that? :open_mouth:

–
Cheers / Saludos,

Carlos E. R.

(from 13.1 x86_64 “Bottle” (Minas Tirith))

16

I think he mistakenly thinks kernel-firmware is part of the official kernel distribution.

17

Note also the firm-ware is not installed by default you have to install it if you need/want it

This is because hardware manufactures do not opensource there drivers and firm-wear. So if you need to use or want to optimize various pieces of hardware you do need binary blobs supplied by said makers.

To have a fully open source system you must chose your hardware very very carefully.

18

On 2015-07-14 16:36, Miuku wrote:
>
> robin_listas;2719524 Wrote:
>> Do you have evidence for that? :open_mouth:
> I think he mistakenly thinks kernel-firmware is part of the official
> kernel distribution.

Could be.

Or thinking of nvidia drivers, for instance, but they are not inside the
kernel, but outside.

Maybe there is confussion about what is inside/outside? Inside is not
“linked” or somehow included, but done by the kernel devs.

–
Cheers / Saludos,

Carlos E. R.

(from 13.1 x86_64 “Bottle” (Minas Tirith))

19

here: Explaining Why We Don't Endorse Other Systems - GNU Project - Free Software Foundation

  • The kernel that they distribute (in most cases, Linux) includes “blobs”: pieces of object code distributed without source, usually firmware to run some device.

and here: ::[FSFLA]:: GNU Linux-libre project

am I wrong? are they wrong?

20

So how do a small minority of users deal with the fact that much hardware is in fact only usable with closed source binaries. There are only so many willing and able to reverse engineer the vast number of device drivers need to run viable modern desktop on modern hardware. It is true that many distro’s do include some common binary non open thing. openSUSE is NOT one. Yes the blobs are made available but that is not the same as including a non-OSS in the actual distribution. Any OSS is chosen to be installed by the user. No one forces OSS only or non-OSS included this is something that is up to the user who is FREE to chose. There is also the freedom to install closed source if you want which apparently the GNU people don’t think is a freedom. In any case openSUSE is OPEN source out of the box what you do after is up to you.