boot loader below 128GB?

English Install/Boot/Login
1

I was installing 11.3 x64 on my new system (dual booting with pre-installed Win7 x64 on a Pavilion dv7t) and get this ominous message while setting up the install: “The boot loader is installed on a partition that is not entirely below 128 GB, the system might not boot.” True, I’m sort of forced to install to an extended partition above 200GB on my 500GB hard drive - but I don’t remember ever seeing this message before.

Stopped me in my tracks - I’ve been searching for what this means and whether I should be worried about it. I’ve had OpenSuSE installed on partitions far beyond 128GB. Can anyone clear this up for me or point me toward an explanation of the issue before I go ahead and install (while holding my breath)? I tried checking the box for installation to MBR, but this warning remained.

TIA!!!
Patti

found this - can’t really understand how to fix: http://forums.opensuse.org/english/get-help-here/install-boot-login/442152-11-3-dvd-indicates-wrong-hd-size-grub-living-forbidden-zone-error.html

I should mention that from that page is pretty much my same setup:
“On this laptop, I have something similar. sda1, 2, and 3 belong to
windows 7 and recovery partition.”

2

On 07/21/2010 04:36 PM, PattiMichelle wrote:
>
> I was installing 11.3 x64 on my new system (dual booting with
> pre-installed Win7 x64 on a Pavilion dv7t) and get this ominous message
> while setting up the install: “The boot loader is installed on a
> partition that is not entirely below 128 GB, the system might not boot.”
> True, I’m sort of forced to install to an extended partition above
> 200GB on my 500GB hard drive - but I don’t remember ever seeing this
> message before.
>
> Stopped me in my tracks - I’ve been searching for what this means and
> whether I should be worried about it. I’ve had OpenSuSE installed on
> partitions far beyond 128GB. Can anyone clear this up for me or point
> me toward an explanation of the issue before I go ahead and install
> (while holding my breath)? I tried checking the box for installation to
> MBR, but this warning remained.

The warning is there because the disk driver in some BIOS codes cannot read
above that boundary. Newer machines do not have this restriction and yours
should not, but Linux tries to work on all machines.

3

TYVM for the info!! I figured that might be the case. I guess I could always PING my entire hard drive to an external - but my new computer didn’t come with an actual Win7 CD, so it would be difficult to resurrect if I broke the bootloader. Message should prolly read “might not boot in hard drives manufactured before 2006” - for semi-noobs like me ;^) I wasn’t sure if it was a bios thing, a grub thing, or a linux thing…

Thanks Again!
Patti

4

On 07/21/2010 09:36 PM, PattiMichelle wrote:
>
> TYVM for the info!! I figured that might be the case. I guess I could
> always PING my entire hard drive to an external - but my new computer
> didn’t come with an actual Win7 CD, so it would be difficult to
> resurrect if I broke the bootloader. Message should prolly read “might
> not boot in hard drives manufactured before 2006” - for semi-noobs like
> me ;^) I wasn’t sure if it was a bios thing, a grub thing, or a linux
> thing…

It is not when the drive was manufactured. It is the number of bits that the
BIOS disk driver (software) can handle. It is the age of the computer.

5

I have the same (potential) issue trying to install 11.3 on a new Asus UL20 w/Windows7.

However, the following thread gives me pause as Grub apparently hangs:

Grub warning

It’s not clear how new/old their HW might be?

So, I’m uneasy about forging ahead. With some effort I could re-partition and create a /boot partition, but I’d rather not.

How likely is the default setup (ie grub installed in extended partition above 128GB) to work on a current BIOS?

6

It is a bios limitation. The bios can not access partitions above the specified limit. You need the /boot mount point below 128GB and from there the stage 1.5 or stage 2 can function as prescribed to a root above the 128GB barrier.

7

hmm, I also have the same issue with new Dell XPS 7100, amd x6 1090, 8GB ram
windows 7 already installed in the 195.23GB partition, see below

101.98 MB, HPFS/NTFS (/dev/sda1, LABEL=System Reserved)
195.23 GB, HPFS/NTFS (/dev/sda2, LABEL=OS)
439.46 GB, HPFS/NTFS (/dev/sda3, LABEL=data)
63.86 GB, unassigned

I intended to park opensuse 11.3 in the unassigned partition, but at the installation overview I got note in red like the one Patti described above.

@lwfinger, you said an age PC, but this is a new one

@techwiz03, I dont understand your suggestion, can you be specific?

Thanks a lot.

8

On 08/04/2010 09:36 AM, teddyyoung wrote:
>
> hmm, I also have the same issue with new Dell XPS 7100, amd x6 1090, 8GB
> ram
> windows 7 already installed in the 195.23GB partition, see below
>
> 101.98 MB, HPFS/NTFS (/dev/sda1, LABEL=System Reserved)
> 195.23 GB, HPFS/NTFS (/dev/sda2, LABEL=OS)
> 439.46 GB, HPFS/NTFS (/dev/sda3, LABEL=data)
> 63.86 GB, unassigned
>
> I intended to park opensuse 11.3 in the unassigned partition, but at
> the installation overview I got note in red like the one Patti described
> above.
>
> @lwfinger, you said an age PC, but this is a new one

Yes, a new PC will probably be able to boot with the boot loader above 128 GB,
while an old PC might fail. As the code doing the installation cannot tell the
capabilities of your BIOS, the warning is issued. A warning only means that some
situation exists that may cause problems. In most cases, you can ignore them.
Errors, on the other hand, need attention.

9

As lwfinger stated, you are a getting a warning not an error. For some reason your new PC’s BIOS is giving the installer an indication that boot code must be below 128GB. On a new PC this limit should not be an issue and is likely a BIOS bug or oversight. However, you may find that after installation, you may get boot errors and as I found with 1 Dell occasional kernel panics at boot. Your boot folder can be a small partition all on it’s own of about 50MB to 100MB. The easiest fix I would normally suggest is to use gparted to move partitions and make a small boot partition of 100MB below the 128GB threshold such as:
101.98MB, NTFS ‘/dev/sda1 system reserved’ <<– this may be just a re-installer for windows in case it gets damaged
127.13GB, NTFS ’ /dev/sda2 Windows OS’ <<– resized partition
68.0+.1+439.46+63.86, extended ‘/dev/sda3’
100MB, ‘Linux native - /dev/sda5 ext4 mount /boot’ <<– room for all boot files well below threshold
68GB, NTFS ‘/dev/sda6 windows swap and extra windows programs’
439.46GB, NTFS ‘/dev/sda7 data’ <<– move from primary to extended partition
8GB, Linux-swap ‘/dev/sda8 swap’ <<– created swap space
55.86GB Linux-root ‘/dev/sda9 /’ <<– created root partition but you may decide to use separate /home rather than include it here

The possibilities are endless, but the above basically reduces the windows partition so a boot can exist below 128GB and the balance of the old partition
becomes a logical drive. /dev/sda3 becomes an extended partition as a container for multiple logical drives. First one of course needs to be the /boot, second logical would be the extra from the old windows partition, third would be data and the balance for linux / /home swap …

** If you haven’t created your installation back-up Disc’s for windows 7 STOP! and do this first!!!, If you haven’t backed up any important data STOP and do it, If you haven’t defrag’d windows STOP!!! and do it before resizing.**

10

On 2010-07-21 23:36, PattiMichelle wrote:
>
> I was installing 11.3 x64 on my new system (dual booting with
> pre-installed Win7 x64 on a Pavilion dv7t) and get this ominous message
> while setting up the install: “The boot loader is installed on a
> partition that is not entirely below 128 GB, the system might not boot.”
> True, I’m sort of forced to install to an extended partition above
> 200GB on my 500GB hard drive - but I don’t remember ever seeing this
> message before.
>

<http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Logical_block_addressing#LBA.2C_ATA_devices_and_Enhanced_BIOS>

At best, the 10/8/6 scheme of the BIOS meant an MS-DOS volume (and a Windows
NT 4.0 system partition) was limited to 7.8 GiB, even given these methods of
translation. The ATA-1 standard of 28 bit LBA limits disks to 128 GiB (≈137.4 GB),
assuming 512 byte sectors. In 2002 ATA-6 introduced the 48 bit LBA, extending
the possible disk sizes to 128 PiB, assuming 512 byte sectors.

<http://www.dewassoc.com/kbase/hard_drives/drive_size_barrier_limitations_2.htm>

<http://www.dewassoc.com/kbase/hard_drives/hard_drive_size_barriers.htm>

The ATA Interface Limit (128 GiB / 137 GB) Barrier

In order to avoid previous disk barriers and limitations, other than those
imposed by the operating systems themselves, today’s hard drives no longer
rely upon discrete geometry (specific cylinder, head and sector numbers)
and instead use logical block addressing and a sector number. Unfortunately,
even when we move away from bit addressing in favor of head and sector numbers,
we still reach the limit of our ability to address all of the bits when taken
together. Let’s take a look at the ATA interface. There are 28 bits used for
the sector number interface with the operating system, BIOS and the hard disk.
This means a hard disk can have a maximum of 2^28 or 268,435,456 sectors of
512 bytes, placing the ATA interface maximum at 128 GiB or approximately 137.4 GB.

If your BIOS supports ATA-6, you don’t have a problem. Grub needs the BIOS to boot. So you get a
warning, but not an error. I think you will have to try. It is possible that it sim ply works.

–
Cheers / Saludos,

Carlos E. R.
(from 11.2 x86_64 “Emerald” GM (Elessar))