Apple's dirty tricks

Jobs has learned a few things from his friends in Redmond.

For Apple, No Tactic Is Too Sneaky When It Comes to Defending the iPad | BNET

Win at any cost.

Yep, today a trial has started here in which Apple requires the prohibition of sales of Samsung Galaxy devices…This patent war is killing. Next thing is that my kids are being sued for not liking some product. Let them spend their money and energy on other things.

On 08/10/2011 12:46 PM, chief sealth wrote:
>
> Jobs has learned a few things from his friends in Redmond.
>
> ‘For Apple, No Tactic Is Too Sneaky When It Comes to Defending the iPad
> | BNET’ (http://tinyurl.com/3wnsgep)
>
> Win at any cost.
>
>

It not Apple that is the problem. Its the patents that are the problems.
With the current patent laws in place, there is simply no really
competition and innovation.
Just recently it was said on the radio that there more than 1000 patents
on the current smartphones.
For people that dislike Apple this is of course a thing to rant about,
but i see it as a general problem that every company faces.
I’ll bet that biggest budget from any of these companies is in the legal
department.


Euer Komputerfriek Joerg
using LXDE on 11.4 x64 and happy with a cup of really hot coffee…

On Wed, 10 Aug 2011 22:24:41 +0000, JoergJaeger wrote:

> It not Apple that is the problem. Its the patents that are the problems.

It’s a little of both, I think.

The patents are certainly a problem.

But Apple could also decide to compete based on the merits rather than
trying to eliminate competition by asserting the patents in the way they
are to stifle competition.

As long as Apple do this, I won’t have anything to do with them.

Jim


Jim Henderson
openSUSE Forums Administrator
Forum Use Terms & Conditions at http://tinyurl.com/openSUSE-T-C

On 08/10/2011 06:39 PM, Jim Henderson wrote:
> On Wed, 10 Aug 2011 22:24:41 +0000, JoergJaeger wrote:
>
>> It not Apple that is the problem. Its the patents that are the problems.
>
> It’s a little of both, I think.
>
> The patents are certainly a problem.
>
> But Apple could also decide to compete based on the merits rather than
> trying to eliminate competition by asserting the patents in the way they
> are to stifle competition.
>
> As long as Apple do this, I won’t have anything to do with them.
>
>
> Jim
>

Well, i think you should remember that Samsung did the same a while ago
with Apple. Kind off a payback.
http://www.pcworld.com/businesscenter/article/226004/samsung_countersues_apple_in_ongoing_patent_silliness.html#tk.mod_rel
But true, Apple could have also chosen to just compete.
The truth is that the only people wondering about this are insiders. For
the most part people don’t even hear about it, unless they listen to
business news.


Euer Komputerfriek Joerg
using LXDE on 11.4 x64 and happy with a cup of really hot coffee…

On Thu, 11 Aug 2011 01:51:30 +0000, JoergJaeger wrote:

> Well, i think you should remember that Samsung did the same a while ago
> with Apple. Kind off a payback.
> http://www.pcworld.com/businesscenter/article/226004/
samsung_countersues_apple_in_ongoing_patent_silliness.html#tk.mod_rel
> But true, Apple could have also chosen to just compete. The truth is
> that the only people wondering about this are insiders. For the most
> part people don’t even hear about it, unless they listen to business
> news.

Sure, Apple’s not the only bad player in this; this isn’t the only reason
I won’t have anything to do with them, either - I don’t particularly like
what I’ve heard about their developer agreement (and the fact that the
agreement itself is an NDA for the agreement doesn’t really make me feel
good about it, either).

Jim


Jim Henderson
openSUSE Forums Administrator
Forum Use Terms & Conditions at http://tinyurl.com/openSUSE-T-C

to me a different side of this story is a bit weird… what does Apple want to protect in Europe? In Europe the market for Apple is limited anyway, because they try to play “elite”. Example: the iPhone. The only ones who have one, are “elite” people. I don´t know any german who has an iPhone, but know a lot of german Android owners. On the other hand, I know a lot americans who have an iPhone.
I don´t know the reasons for that, because the prices are not that different. But maybe it is because Apple used to be expensive in Europe and therefore nobody even thinks about buying one. I also always get requests from german friends, that I should bring some Apple stuff from the US over to Germany. But the prices aren´t that different. So this thinking must have a reason which lies in the last years: Apple = expensive.

The same goes for the iPad. So do they just want to harm Samsung? And that´s it? Because Apple themselves will not have any advantage of this. They won´t sell more iPads, even when they eliminate their competition.

My feeling is that in the US, Apple is a brand like every other. If you want to buy a mobile or a tablet, you compare all the prices between all brands, incl. Apple. In Europe you have all the brands. And Apple. You compare all the prices between all the brands. And forget about Apple. Because you know: you can not afford it anyway or you don´t get the most for your money.

I think, Apple just wanted to hurt Samsung for the other suit, which was initiated by Samsung regarding the iPhone. And I am sure that Samsung will strike back.

They’re going after Motorola as well, so I doubt revenge is the only motive. MS is probably making more money off of Android than it is from its own mobile products and Apple is sure aware of that. Claiming a patent on the shape of a tablet is ludicrous, but if they get away with it, they won’t care how iPad sells in Europe.

Note however that the current injunction is not based on patents but
rather on the way the product looks.


Marcel Cox
http://support.novell.com/forums

Marcel Cox’s Profile: http://forums.novell.com/member.php?userid=8

On 08/11/2011 09:56 AM, steffen13 wrote:
>
> to me a different side of this story is a bit weird… what does Apple
> want to protect in Europe? In Europe the market for Apple is limited
> anyway, because they try to play “elite”. Example: the iPhone. The only
> ones who have one, are “elite” people. I don´t know any german who has
> an iPhone, but know a lot of german Android owners. On the other hand, I
> know a lot americans who have an iPhone.

Apples mainmarket used to be france and germany. My knowledge is a
little rusted there, but i hint that it is still the same.

I don’t think it is elite, its just a lifestyle. That was always true
for any Apple product.

This proofs again, that patents are the root of all evil.
The sentence reads

Like the Galaxy Tab 10.1, Apple claims the
Xoom tablet infringes on its registered EU Community Design for the
iPad, though it’s not clear if Apple has yet requested a similar
preliminary injunction against Motorola

As longs as there are patent laws we will see these kind of silly
accusation.
Besides, Samsung is a big supplier to Apple as well. Or they switched
the supplier, not sure about that.
If there would be no base (with a different kind of patent law)
companies had to finaly compete and innovate since there would be no
protection to a design (if proofen) or code or function.

The most i read is, that most companies make a deal behind closed doors
where matters get settled which applies also to troll lawsuits.


Euer Komputerfriek Joerg
using LXDE on 11.4 x64 and happy with a cup of real hot coffee…

Please, Joerg: have a cup of really hot coffee and think again. This is not about patent law, but about registered design.

Community design - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
http://oami.europa.eu/ows/rw/resource/documents/RCD/regulations/62002_en_cv.pdf

Gemeinschaftsgeschmacksmuster – Wikipedia
Text der Verordnung über das Gemeinschaftsgeschmacksmuster (GGV)

Apple got a preliminary injunction and they will have to defend it in a regular court proceeding. If they fail they risk to pay quite an amount of damages to Samsung.

Patents by themselves aren’t evil, it’s how they are used that makes them good or bad. Patents are designed to protect the inventor, not so much to limit creativity. I think what we’re seeing is more of misuse of patents and the patent laws. Trying to stifle creativity and competition, which was never ment to happen with patents. The problem is greed. As it always is.

On 08/12/2011 05:16 AM, vodoo wrote:
>
> Please, Joerg: have a cup of really hot coffee and think again. This is
> not about patent law, but about registered design.
>
> ‘Community design - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia’
> (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Community_design)
> http://tinyurl.com/6c37y9
>
> ‘Gemeinschaftsgeschmacksmuster – Wikipedia’
> (http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gemeinschaftsgeschmacksmuster)
> ‘Text der Verordnung über das Gemeinschaftsgeschmacksmuster (GGV)’
> (http://tinyurl.com/3da2926)
>
> Apple got a preliminary injunction and they will have to defend it in a
> regular court proceeding. If they fail they risk to pay quite an amount
> of damages to Samsung.
>
>

Hey, i did take a cup of coffee and feel so much better now.
slurp - ah -
Ok, the main case is about design (look a like) and brand recognition.
If a product looks like brand A, but its brand B, this can lead to
confused customers and loss for brand A.

What i am not saying is, if thats a good decision for Apple to go
rampage on a competitor.
But that happens all the time and its getting only attention because its
in consumer electronics and not, let say, a car.

To me there is not a big difference between a patent and registered
design. In both cases the maker hold the right to its own and anyone
infringing on it can be taken to the courts of violating design or patents.


Euer Komputerfriek Joerg
using LXDE on 11.4 x64 and happy with a cup of real hot coffee…

On 08/12/2011 08:06 AM, Jonathan R wrote:
>
> Patents by themselves aren’t evil, it’s how they are used that makes
> them good or bad. Patents are designed to protect the inventor, not so
> much to limit creativity. I think what we’re seeing is more of misuse of
> patents and the patent laws. Trying to stifle creativity and
> competition, which was never ment to happen with patents. The problem is
> greed. As it always is.
>
>

Patents have proofen to be an obstacle in innovation. Every time
something gets developed there will be current patents that are present.
As this case shows, even if a another company would make a better
product it has to overcome the limitation of copying.
This can be tricky, since people have preferences.

If you say people are greedy, that may be true. So is everybody and all
entities.
If patents are so great, why do we not see more innovations going on.
Instead of looking in IT, just look in pharmacy.
Innovation only happens, if a company has to stay on top of innovation.
But instead companies milk their innovation and stop innovating.


Euer Komputerfriek Joerg
using LXDE on 11.4 x64 and happy with a cup of real hot coffee…

On 08/12/2011 05:07 PM, JoergJaeger wrote:
> On 08/12/2011 08:06 AM, Jonathan R wrote:
>>
>> Patents by themselves aren’t evil, it’s how they are used that makes
>> them good or bad. Patents are designed to protect the inventor, not so
>> much to limit creativity. I think what we’re seeing is more of misuse of
>> patents and the patent laws. Trying to stifle creativity and
>> competition, which was never ment to happen with patents. The problem is
>> greed. As it always is.
>>
>>
>
> Patents have proofen to be an obstacle in innovation. Every time
> something gets developed there will be current patents that are present.
> As this case shows, even if a another company would make a better
> product it has to overcome the limitation of copying.
> This can be tricky, since people have preferences.
>
> If you say people are greedy, that may be true. So is everybody and all
> entities.
> If patents are so great, why do we not see more innovations going on.
> Instead of looking in IT, just look in pharmacy.
> Innovation only happens, if a company has to stay on top of innovation.
> But instead companies milk their innovation and stop innovating.
>
>

Just want to add something to it.
Not sure if anyone remembers the game ‘Giana Sisters’ (late 80s) (gee
nice memories) but this was exactly the same case.
The game looks like a mario clone and because of that Nintendo sued the
developer and the game was taken from the market.
My point is, that this is an old issue and nothing new. It gets more
attention because its a big company and everybody loves Apple, apparently.


Euer Komputerfriek Joerg
using LXDE on 11.4 x64 and happy with a cup of real hot coffee…

I don’t think it is elite, its just a lifestyle. That was always true
for any Apple product.

I’m not sure when I last read a more stupid comment! Apple produce products only, not lifestyles!!

Let’s avoid personal attacks, dvhenry. That’s not necessary here.

Jim


Jim Henderson
openSUSE Forums Administrator
Forum Use Terms & Conditions at http://tinyurl.com/openSUSE-T-C

Please ignore the first part of my comment at post #16, I’m having a bad day, the post should read,

I don’t think it is elite, its just a lifestyle. That was always true
for any Apple product.

Apple produce products only, not lifestyles!!

That I can agree with. Apple is a company that makes products. It’s people that make lifestyles. Although I think what JoergJaegeris meant, is that Apples products tend to be higher end and more pricey, and thereby equated to a higher lifestyle. Just a guess though.

On Sat, 13 Aug 2011 05:06:02 +0000, dvhenry wrote:

> Please ignore the first part of my comment at post #16, I’m having a bad
> day,

Thank you for reposting, I’ll delete the other post (and my reply to it).

Jim


Jim Henderson
openSUSE Forums Administrator
Forum Use Terms & Conditions at http://tinyurl.com/openSUSE-T-C