a zypper and the update repo curiosity

[Tyler_K]

Hi,

as we may know, the update repo (actually now plural; OSS and non-OSS) is for “[size=3]official security and bugfix updates[/size]”.

Okie dokie, now lets follow the rabbit:

# zypper lp
Loading repository data...
Reading installed packages...

Repository           | Name              | Version | Category    | Status | Summary                                             
---------------------+-------------------+---------+-------------+--------+-----------------------------------------------------
openSUSE-12.2-Update | openSUSE-2012-733 | 1       | recommended | needed | rsyslog: Update to 5.10.1 [V5-stable]               
openSUSE-12.2-Update | openSUSE-2012-735 | 1       | recommended | needed | grub2: ignore extended partitions other then primary
openSUSE-12.2-Update | openSUSE-2012-736 | 1       | recommended | needed | lvm2: boot.lvm not being started on boot-up         

Compared to:

# zypper lu | grep Update
v | openSUSE-12.2-Update | device-mapper                       | 1.02.63-26.8.1  | 1.02.63-26.12.1   | x86_64
v | openSUSE-12.2-Update | grub2                               | 2.00-1.11.1     | 2.00-1.15.1       | x86_64
v | openSUSE-12.2-Update | lvm2                                | 2.02.84-26.8.2  | 2.02.84-26.12.1   | x86_64
v | openSUSE-12.2-Update | rsyslog                             | 5.10.0-2.4.1    | 5.10.1-2.8.1      | x86_64

One extra package … lets check it out:

# zypper info -t patch device-mapper
Loading repository data...
Reading installed packages...


patch 'device-mapper' not found.

Not a patch you say, eh … okay, tell me about it:

# zypper info device-mapper
Loading repository data...
Reading installed packages...


Information for package device-mapper:

Repository: openSUSE-12.2-Update
Name: device-mapper
Version: 1.02.63-26.12.1
Arch: x86_64
Vendor: openSUSE
Installed: Yes
Status: out-of-date (version 1.02.63-26.8.1 installed)
Installed Size: 366.3 KiB
Summary: Device Mapper Tools
Description: 
Programs, libraries, and man pages for configuring and using the device
mapper.

How about a comparison to one of the other “patches” (as defined per “zypper lp”)

# zypper info rsyslog
Loading repository data...
Reading installed packages...


Information for package rsyslog:

Repository: openSUSE-12.2-Update
Name: rsyslog
Version: 5.10.1-2.8.1
Arch: x86_64
Vendor: openSUSE
Installed: Yes
Status: out-of-date (version 5.10.0-2.4.1 installed)
Installed Size: 1.5 MiB
Summary: The enhanced syslogd for Linux and Unix
Description: 
Rsyslog is an enhanced multi-threaded syslogd supporting, among others,
MySQL, syslog/tcp, RFC 3195, permitted sender lists, filtering on any
message part, and fine grain output format control. It is quite
compatible to stock sysklogd and can be used as a drop-in replacement.
Its advanced features make it suitable for enterprise-class, encryption
protected syslog relay chains while at the same time being very easy to
setup for the novice user.

And lastly, does it fit any where in the security and recommended - needed and not needed universe?:

# zypper lp -a | tail
openSUSE-12.2-Update          | openSUSE-2012-727        | 1       | recommended | not needed | lmms:  Fix ZyAddSubFX and VST  plugins                                                                                                                                                                                                                       
openSUSE-12.2-Update         | openSUSE-2012-729        | 1       |  recommended | not needed | gdm: fixed passwordless  bug                                                                                                                                                                                                                                
openSUSE-12.2-Update         | openSUSE-2012-730        | 1       |  recommended | not needed | poppler: fix printing with postscript  capable printers that fail in some  cases                                                                                                                                                                             
openSUSE-12.2-Update         | openSUSE-2012-731        | 1       |  recommended | not needed | safte-monitor: create /var/run/safte-monitor  at service start time instead of install  time                                                                                                                                                                 
openSUSE-12.2-Update         | openSUSE-2012-732        | 1       |  recommended | not needed | gtkpod: Fix crash when opening  preferences                                                                                                                                                                                                                 
openSUSE-12.2-Update         | openSUSE-2012-733        | 1       |  recommended | needed     | rsyslog: Update to 5.10.1  [V5-stable]                                                                                                                                                                                                                      
openSUSE-12.2-Update         | openSUSE-2012-734        | 1       |  recommended | not needed | rsh: Fork before exec to avoid SIGHUP from  systemd-logind                                                                                                                                                                                                  
openSUSE-12.2-Update         | openSUSE-2012-735        | 1       |  recommended | needed     | grub2: ignore extended partitions other then   primary                                                                                                                                                                                                       
openSUSE-12.2-Update         | openSUSE-2012-736        | 1       |  recommended | needed     | lvm2: boot.lvm not being started on  boot-up                                                                                                                                                                                                                
openSUSE-12.2-Update         | openSUSE_Maintenance_804 | 1       |  recommended | not needed | xfce4-panel-plugin-wavelan: Update to  version 0.5.11   

Ummmmm, okay, what gives.

Packaging mistake? User (mine) ignorance (about the_repo/zypper kungfu/patch_and/or_update handling/package’s status) ? Repo synch issue?

[Tyler_K]

@Tyler_K

One extra package … lets check it out:

# zypper info -t patch device-mapper
Loading repository data...
Reading installed packages...


patch 'device-mapper' not found.

Not a patch you say, eh

Ahh, user error there. Example, known patch using same syntax also produces same result:

# zypper info -t patch rsyslog
Loading repository data...
Reading installed packages...


patch 'rsyslog' not found.

Solution: call it by proper name:

# zypper info -t patch openSUSE-2012-733

Result: long output that is unnecessary to repost here.

Still…the curiosity presented by the device-mapper package remains …

[user]

On 10/24/2012 07:56 PM, Tyler K wrote:
> lets follow the rabbit:
>
> # zypper lp
> Compared to:
> # zypper lu | grep Update
>
> One extra package … lets check it out:

since “lp” and “lu” are different commands should we be surprised if
they give different results?

hmmmm…sorry i can neither follow the rabbit nor catch your point in
the rest of your ‘question’…but, i freely admit to often having
insufficient patience … so, again: sorry–and hopefully someone else
can help.

–
dd

[VampirD]

Did you read the zypper man page?

zypper lp list only patches and zypper lu list updates, you can’t se
device-mapper on the output of zypper lp because its not a patch

[Tyler_K]

Did you read the zypper man page?

Read the man page in entirety? Of course not.

zypper lp list only patches and zypper lu list updates
yes, of course, but there is a finer point I’m delving into regarding the output produced by these two commands

since “lp” and “lu” are different commands should we be surprised if
they give different results?

hmmmm…sorry i can neither follow the rabbit nor catch your point in
the rest of your ‘question’.

yes, of course, they are different commands and the results should be different. However, what I am (contextually) trying to get at is that (unless I am missing a fine point myself, which is perfectly possible, and is what I’m asking folks to help me see) the results reported in regard to those coming from the update repo should be the same.

The logic hole that I wanted folks to dive into* … or, maybe stated a different way, the key pieces of info in my first post are as follows:

• "the update repo … is for "[size=3]official security and bugfix updates[/size]
  ". " - the “zypper lp” command, of course, is looking exclusively in the update repo, whereas the “zypper lu” draws from a larger set of repos, but which includes
  the update repo - the output of “zypper lp -a” … shows security and non-security “updates” or patches if will … those both “needed” and “not needed”

you can’t se device-mapper on the output of zypper lp because its not a patch

Then what is it then? (distinguish it, whatever type of package it is, from a package known as a “patch” … see the provided “zypper info packagename” comparison) … and if it isn’t a patch or a security update, why is it in the he update repo?

• for anyone unfamiliar, the expression is an allusion to “Alice and Wonderland”, and the act of following the rabbit down the hole

[RedDwarf]

@Tyler_K

yes, of course, they are different commands and the results should be different. However, what I am (contextually) trying to get at is that (unless I am missing a fine point myself, which is perfectly possible, and is what I’m asking folks to help me see) the results reported in regard to those coming from the update repo should be the same.

A “patch”, in ZYpp language, is a higher level entity/concept than a package. A patch fixes a problem, and the fix for a problem may require changes in multiple packages. In this case patch openSUSE-2012-736 requires updates in both lvm2 and device-mapper. Mystery solved.
It’s simply that, you can’t compare patches and packages in the same way that you can’t compare apples and oranges. They are simply different.

The concept of a package is supposed to be too low level for normal users, they only want to know about “applications” and “fixes (patches)”. It’s a nice theory to make it easier to users, but there is still a long way to go until people forgets what a “package” is.

[user]

On 10/24/2012 09:36 PM, Tyler K wrote:
>
> what I am (contextually) trying to get at is that
> (unless I am missing a fine point myself, which is perfectly possible,
> and is what I’m asking folks to help me see) the results reported in
> regard to those coming from the update repo should be the same.

simple: the update repo contains both patches and update packages

lu searches for one, and lp for the other…oh wait, i see RedDwarf
already explained that, in more detail than i easily understand…

you got your answer fini… [SOLVED]

–
dd

[Tyler_K]

@RedDwarf

A “patch”, in ZYpp language, is a higher level entity/concept than a package. A patch fixes a problem, and the fix for a problem may require changes in multiple packages. In this case patch openSUSE-2012-736 requires updates in both lvm2 and device-mapper. Mystery solved.
It’s simply that, you can’t compare patches and packages in the same way that you can’t compare apples and oranges. They are simply different.

Ahh, yes, thanks. Oops, silly me – I was stuck in incorrectly thinking of the payload as being in terms of a one to one basis (one package to one patch). For the record, its also clearly mentioned in the man page: “patch - update of one or more packages”.

(I might have eventually also made that connection if I had bothered to check the output of “zypper info -t patch openSUSE-2012-736”)