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Thread: a Zypper Dup survey

  1. #1

    Default a Zypper Dup survey

    I have relied on Tumbleweed for some months now, update exclusively with zypper dup, and am curious about the practices of others with this command.

    Three questions:

    (1) Do you boot to console to run zypper dup, or run it in a terminal window with the desktop loaded?

    I now press 'e' at the grub menu to boot to console before running the command, but wonder if I'm being overly cautious.

    (2) How long have you waited between invocations of zypper dup?

    I run zypper dup several times a week on the machine I use daily. I also installed it on a couple of laptops that get little use. I now worry that Tumbleweed could choke on the number of packages to be downloaded/updated if I let one of these laptops sit in mothballs for several months.

    Has anyone let a Tumbleweed machine sit for many months (or longer) between zypper dup commands?

    (3) Dealing with problem messages.

    Zypper dup occasionally reports unhappiness with system configuration, along the lines of the now-solved problem reported in: https://forums.opensuse.org/showthre...56#post2845056

    Code:
    Problem: nothing provides cinnamon-settings-daemon >= 3.6.0 needed by cinnamon-settings-daemon-lang-3.6.1-1.1.noarch
    Problem: nemo-3.4.7-1.3.x86_64 requires cinnamon-translations, but this requirement cannot be provided
    Problem: nemo-3.4.7-1.3.x86_64 requires cinnamon-translations, but this requirement cannot be provided
    Problem: nemo-3.4.7-1.3.x86_64 requires cinnamon-translations, but this requirement cannot be provided
    
    Solution 1:  deinstallation of cinnamon-settings-daemon-lang-3.4.4-1.3.noarch
    Solution 2:  keep obsolete cinnamon-settings-daemon-lang-3.4.4-1.3.noarch
    Solution 3:  break cinnamon-settings-daemon-lang-3.6.1-1.1.noarch by ignoring some of its dependencies
    I am not as sophisticated as other Tumbleweed users, and often scratch my head about what to do. Usually, I take the first suggested option, and hope for the best. I'm curious about what others do.

  2. #2
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    Default Re: a Zypper Dup survey

    Hi
    I usually run a zypper dup via ssh to my Tumbleweed systems (Laptop and RPI3), just run the standard GNOME DE on the laptop plus a few extra repos eg hamradio. The RPI3 is a JeOS release. Run the screen command if on the DE of the laptop before a zypper dup.

    Updates as per the ML notification of a new snapshot, but do miss the occasional one.

    Don't seem to hit many these days, if it's a lang one, usually delete the offending package and run with --no-recommends.
    Cheers Malcolm °¿° SUSE Knowledge Partner (Linux Counter #276890)
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  3. #3
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    Default Re: a Zypper Dup survey

    Quote Originally Posted by Tuner View Post
    (1) Do you boot to console to run zypper dup, or run it in a terminal window with the desktop loaded?
    I run it from a terminal window under the desktop.

    However:

    I first do:
    Code:
    screen -L
    That way, if the desktop crashes, screen keeps running and my "zypper dup" keeps running. After a desktop crash or restart, I can use:
    Code:
    tail -f screenlog.0
    to monitor the progress, and reboot when done.

    I should add that, before the "zypper dup", I use
    Code:
    rm screenlog.0
    to remove the log from the previous update. Otherwise they are cumulative.

    Desktop crashes are rare. I think the last one was more than a year ago. With the "screen -L", I'm reasonably well protected from the effects.

    (2) How long have you waited between invocations of zypper dup?
    I am updating once or twice per week.

    (3) Dealing with problem messages.
    I can usually figure out what's a suitable choice. Sometimes I look at the factory mailing list for hints. Occasionally, I skip an update if I can't work it out.

    Occasionally, I'll cancel the update, then use Yast to explore why there's a problem. That can give me hints on what to do.
    opensuse Leap 42.3; KDE Plasma 5;
    opensuse tumbleweed; KDE Plasma 5 (test system);

  4. #4
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    Default Re: a Zypper Dup survey

    For the first several weeks after migrating to TW [May/June this year] i dup'd daily or every other day, but over time i grew rebellious at the constant interruptions to my workflow [not from the dups per se, but from the need to then logout/in or more likely reboot each time afterwards]. Consequently i now dup ~weekly [ideally it'd be fortnightly, but my Tower has proven pathologically incapable of exceeding 6 days' Uptime before freezing or auto-rebooting (the next one is "due" to occur tomorrow), after which i sometimes dup in the wan hope that maybe this time the underlying fault might be fixed]. I do review the Mailing List daily, & if i see any important security updates, or a Plasma update, then i'll usually bring fwd my dup.

    Because i'm a pessimist, with the track record to justify it [eg, https://forums.opensuse.org/showthre...nt-Catastrophe, https://forums.opensuse.org/showthre...925-dup-failed, https://forums.opensuse.org/showthre...ReadOnly-again, https://forums.opensuse.org/showthre...but-not-login], i almost always ban myself from doing the dup unless/until i first perform my data backups. For that i use BackInTime, running in the desktop, thus given i am already in desktop not tty, once BiT has finished i immediately dup in desktop session via Konsole.

  5. #5
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    Default Re: a Zypper Dup survey

    (1) Do you boot to console to run zypper dup, or run it in a terminal window with the desktop loaded?

    Done thru Konsole in session though nickrets way has me intrigued

    (2) How long have you waited between invocations of zypper dup?

    Usually every 2 days at 100AM my time US CST I'm nocturnal so if it goes badly for me an inconvenience not a problem.

    (3) Dealing with problem messages.

    For me it depends some were for packages I no longer use or never did in these cases (the most recent xine) I'll hit the deinstallation
    If it's a Packman Package being obsolete I'll exit and wait sometimes TW gets away from them.
    If it says something about i586 do I want the lower architecture I'll just exit then wait a couple days.
    So far in my experience with TW letting go of those obsolete packages has been good when it an opensuse package.
    This is also where BTRFS and Snapper comes in handy (2x for me) however there was a time when Snapper didn't work for me(only been once)
    That's why I go to the TW download site get the latest version if it works and make boot stick or a disc. This is my last resort if things go REALLY WRONG!!
    We are what we think.
    All that we are arises with our thoughts.
    With our thoughts we make the world.

    My 64 bit: Gateway 5670| Nvidia GeForce GT610 |CPU AMD Phenom 8400|4G RAM
    Opensuse Tumbleweed Plasma 5

  6. #6

    Default Re: a Zypper Dup survey

    1-I don't remember ever doing dup while logged into any X session, reasons among which: a-I want to take expeditious advantage of all newly updated packages X uses; b-I don't want to risk settings corruption that could result from a crash or forced app or X restart during the dup.
    2-2 to 3 months between dups on TW are typical here, but they vary between as little as a day, and upwards of 6 months. I have one operable 32bit machine whose TW was last updated 101 weeks ago. I don't download in advance either: commit.downloadMode = DownloadAsNeeded in zypp.conf.
    3-problem messages I deal with ad hoc, seat of the pants, often retrying after tweaking mirror specifications in repos.d/

  7. #7

    Default Re: a Zypper Dup survey

    Thanks for the replies, one and all! I hadn't known about the screen command (perhaps more evidence of how little I still know about Linux). I'll experiment. And I'm relieved to learn that a regular user is able to go two to three months between dups. I may let my little-used laptops collect more dust before I haul them out for dup updates.

    I have taken a 'play it by ear' approach to the problem messages, guess I'll keep doing so.

  8. #8
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    Default Re: a Zypper Dup survey

    I dup
    1. My laptop on every TW release ( post in the factory ML ) via Konsole
    2. My VPS ~once a week via ssh
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  9. #9
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    Default Re: a Zypper Dup survey

    I have been using tumblewwed for several years now and just use yast to update. Never had any issues so far.

  10. #10
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    Default Re: a Zypper Dup survey

    Quote Originally Posted by Tuner View Post
    (1) Do you boot to console to run zypper dup, or run it in a terminal window with the desktop loaded?
    I always run zypper dup --auto-agree-with-licenses in a terminal


    (2) How long have you waited between invocations of zypper dup?
    I have two machines. One is updated whenever modifications are pending, the other every two months. There is no difference between the two.

    Dealing with problem messages.
    You may use the following heuristic to reduce the number of messages. Most installations have several thousand packages installed from the main repository and several dozens from others such as packman and others. Get a sane installation by disabling all but #3, #4 and 5#:
    Code:
    erlangen:~ # zypper lr -u
    Repository priorities are without effect. All enabled repositories share the same priority.
    
    # | Alias                            | Name                            | Enabled | GPG Check | Refresh | URI                                                                            
    --+----------------------------------+---------------------------------+---------+-----------+---------+--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    1 | Application_Geo                  | Application_Geo                 | Yes     | (r ) Yes  | Yes     | http://download.opensuse.org/repositories/Application:/Geo/openSUSE_Tumbleweed/
    2 | dokuwiki                         | dokuwiki                        | No      | ----      | ----    | http://download.opensuse.org/repositories/home:/werfl/openSUSE_Tumbleweed/     
    3 | download.opensuse.org-non-oss    | Haupt-Repository (NON-OSS)      | Yes     | (r ) Yes  | Yes     | http://download.opensuse.org/tumbleweed/repo/non-oss/                          
    4 | download.opensuse.org-oss        | Haupt-Repository (OSS)          | Yes     | (r ) Yes  | Yes     | http://download.opensuse.org/tumbleweed/repo/oss/                              
    5 | download.opensuse.org-tumbleweed | Hauptaktualisierungs-Repository | Yes     | (r ) Yes  | Yes     | http://download.opensuse.org/update/tumbleweed/                                
    6 | http-ftp.gwdg.de-0265c008        | Packman Repository              | Yes     | (r ) Yes  | Yes     | http://ftp.gwdg.de/pub/linux/packman/suse/openSUSE_Tumbleweed/                 
    7 | http-opensuse-guide.org-37124e10 | libdvdcss repository            | Yes     | (r ) Yes  | Yes     | http://opensuse-guide.org/repo/openSUSE_Tumbleweed/                            
    8 | jalbum                           | jalbum                          | Yes     | (  ) No   | Yes     | http://jalbum.net/download/software/yumrepo/                                   
    9 | myrepo                           | myrepo                          | Yes     | ( p) Yes  | Yes     | dir:///home/karl/Downloads/myrepo                                              
    erlangen:~ #
    Run zypper ref -f, zypper dup, zypper packages --unneeded, zypper packages --orphaned. Delete packages listed if appropriate. Enable the additional repositories one at a time and run zypper dup --from repo-name.
    Intel i3-4130, ASRock Z87 Pro 3, 16GB DDR3-1600, Samsung 840 EVO 250GB, Seagate ST2000DM001 2 TB (ass. in 2014) Tumbleweed
    Intel i7-6700K, ASRock Z170 Pro 4S, 32GB DDR4-2166, Samsung 950 PRO 512GB, Western Digital WD40EZRX 4 TB (ass. in 2016) Tumbleweed

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