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Thread: Info Screens While Installing 42.3

  1. #1

    Default Info Screens While Installing 42.3

    Hello Guys.

    When installing 42.3 (beta) and looking at the info screens, one caught my eye.

    "Your operating system - respecting privacy - providing security. Unlike Windows, you decide which updates get applied when."

    I hate to have to be picky, but this is slightly wrong and mis-leading. Ive used Win XP, Vista and Win 7, and even gave Win 10 a try. And it is actually possible to setup updates on XP, Vista and 7 to either.

    1 - Download and install updates automatically
    2 - Download and let you decide which ones to install
    3 - Just inform you that there are updates, and let you decide which ones to download and install.

    You can even right click and hide updates if you dont want them.

    Ive no idea how Win 10 operates regarding user input on updates.

    Ive also no idea if this has been changed with newer 42.3 updates. I also hate being picky, but I hear too many Linux Users making false statements about Windows. I had one LUG user state "I hate reinstalling windows as it has too many updates". Seems silly when you install a distro, and straight away you have god knows how many updates.

    Heres a scenario for you. A distro that gets released, you download it on the day, and install it straight away, and after rebooting there are updates. I had one that needed 800+ updates, and Im pretty sure that 800+ is more than the total updates for either XP, Vista or Win 7. Normally I get over 200 updates for a linux install. Less depending on how bleeding edge it is.

    openSUSE is a fantastic distro, and Id hate to see it make silly statements about Windows. Linux users who use linux purely for bragging rights tend to say things like "Windoze", "Microshaft" and "M$". I have great respect for linux, its a worldwide global community. Its not an office full of staff in one place, on the same time zone, same language etc. Its global, multicultural, many languages, and just look at the great work that gets done.

    But I can use both Windows and Linux, and use the software that lets me get my job done. I dont tell people that I use linux, as most people i interact with dont know what the hell it is. I dont go out to get my whole family on linux because they dont want to learn how to use a computer, let alone a different OS. In fact my current setup is a dual boot win 7 and opensuse. I use linux for when Im out, and win 7 when Im at home

  2. #2
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    Default Re: Info Screens While Installing 42.3

    I see no request for technical help here, thus this will be moved to General Chitchat.
    CLOSED fort the moment.
    Henk van Velden

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    Default Re: Info Screens While Installing 42.3

    Quote Originally Posted by phillchandler3764 View Post
    Hello Guys.

    When installing 42.3 (beta) and looking at the info screens, one caught my eye.

    "Your operating system - respecting privacy - providing security. Unlike Windows, you decide which updates get applied when."
    Moved from Install/Bot/Login and open again.
    Henk van Velden

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    Default Re: Info Screens While Installing 42.3

    Quote Originally Posted by phillchandler3764 View Post
    You can even right click and hide updates if you dont want them.
    Except you can't any more - Windows 10 forces you to install the patches or you either lose operating system functionality or the ability to install patches at all.

    So the slides are actually spot on.

    Edit:
    In addition to that, Windows 7 "Mainstream" support ended a few years ago and Windows 8.x next year (January). Soon software distributors will stop support 7 and 8 altogether, some games for example no longer work on 7 at all.
    .: miuku #suse @ irc.freenode.net
    :: miuku@opensuse.org

    .: h​ttps://download.opensuse.org/repositories/home:/Miuku/

  5. #5

    Default Re: Info Screens While Installing 42.3

    Quote Originally Posted by Miuku View Post
    Except you can't any more - Windows 10 forces you to install the patches or you either lose operating system functionality or the ability to install patches at all.

    So the slides are actually spot on.

    Edit:
    In addition to that, Windows 7 "Mainstream" support ended a few years ago and Windows 8.x next year (January). Soon software distributors will stop support 7 and 8 altogether, some games for example no longer work on 7 at all.
    So how many people are still using win xp, 7 and vista ? The screenshot i was refering to didnt make it clear which windows version was being talked about, and does opensuse REALLY need to be slating windows to get extra sales ? No. Most home users dont know jack-didly-squat about the workings of OS updates, wont know about linux, wont care about linux. So does slating off windows really count. No. So why does opensuse need to do it ? They dont, it makes opensuse look amatuerish, almost like the linux user who creates his own distro, just to go out and brag, who then finds out that maintaining a Distro is actually hard work, and then after three months the distro gets dropped faster than hot bricks. openSUSE needs to be more professional. Just my opinion.

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    Default Re: Info Screens While Installing 42.3

    Even though a lot is true ( On Win10 there's no delaying updates, openSUSE allows you to add update repos before installation ) I agree that openSUSE doesn't need those remarks on the slides.
    And XP, VIsta, Win7 still used? Yes, you'd be amazed.
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    Default Re: Info Screens While Installing 42.3

    Quote Originally Posted by Knurpht View Post
    Even though a lot is true ( On Win10 there's no delaying updates, openSUSE allows you to add update repos before installation ) I agree that openSUSE doesn't need those remarks on the slides.
    And XP, VIsta, Win7 still used? Yes, you'd be amazed.
    Hi
    There is a WinX utility to add a lock (hide).
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    Default Re: Info Screens While Installing 42.3

    Quote Originally Posted by phillchandler3764 View Post
    it makes opensuse look amatuerish, almost like the linux user who creates his own distro, just to go out and brag
    I suggest you go back and read the Windows XP, Vista and 7 installation slides to see how much bragging is done there ;-)

    It's also good to consider that the "average Joe" today will be installing Windows 10, not 7 or 8, on their brand new machine so whether it was possible to delay or cherry pick updates on XP, Vista or 7 is not really relevant. At the end of the day, I doubt many people even read them in the first place.
    .: miuku #suse @ irc.freenode.net
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    Default Re: Info Screens While Installing 42.3

    Quote Originally Posted by phillchandler3764 View Post
    Ive no idea how Win 10 operates regarding user input on updates.
    My understanding is that you can no longer choose. Windows forces updates.

    On Windows 7, we are now getting "rollups" rather than individual updates. So that means that we take all that are offered (the rollup), or we take none.

    As for the info-screen -- I never look at that slide show, so I never noticed the one that you mention.
    openSUSE Leap 15.2 RC; KDE Plasma 5.18.5;

  10. #10

    Default Re: Info Screens While Installing 42.3

    Quote Originally Posted by Miuku View Post
    I suggest you go back and read the Windows XP, Vista and 7 installation slides to see how much bragging is done there ;-)

    It's also good to consider that the "average Joe" today will be installing Windows 10, not 7 or 8, on their brand new machine so whether it was possible to delay or cherry pick updates on XP, Vista or 7 is not really relevant. At the end of the day, I doubt many people even read them in the first place.
    Oh trust me, being geeky I have read them. What else am I supposed to do after making a cuppa, having a smoke etc. And AFAIR the windows slides were pretty much accurate, each version was better than the previous. So Im going to stick my neck on the block and say that windows bragging (appart from being 90% min correct), was bragging about what it could do over previous versions. It wasnt stating a fact that you couldnt de-select updates.

    And if anyone wants to talk stats, then what about :

    Net Applications / StatCounter

    XP = 6.07 / 3.74
    Vista = 0.46 / 0.69
    7 = 48.43 / 37.67
    8 = 1.35 / 2.09
    8.1 = 6.07 / 7.63
    10 = 27.99 / 31.64

    Seems to me that Win 7 is still THE number one used windows OS out there, which is one of the win versions that you CAN actually choose options for updating your system.

    So sorry to be picky, but just because Windows "Braggs" about how much improved it is over previous versions, doesnt mean ***-for-tat and opensuse can make false claims. If the slide had specifically said "Windows 10" forces updates on the end user, then there would have been no problem.

    As you know win 7 has an icon in the bottom right of the nice flashy desktop. You left click and a box opens, on the left is "Change settings", and then on the right, clicking on "Important" or "Optional" updates lists all updates and has a check box, so simple to deselect, even the "average joe" can do that". And Im assuming that at this moment in time most average joes are still going to install win 7, or buy a second hand pc with win 7, or get win 7 disc to install, as the stats above show that win 7 still has market share in the windows versions.

    Oh just looked. "Cherry picking updates" ? Maybe I didnt explain the point. The point was that the opensuse slide made it specifically sound like ALL versions of Windows forced you to install updates, which was technically, and factually, incorrect. Its a good job the creator of the slide doesnt write legal contracts. Maybe Im being a complete and utter *&%$ and need to go out and get £$%^. And maybe I have nothing better to do than sit unhappyly at home making posts like this.

    It remind me of the blogger who watched "The shawshank redemption", which was a great film, and he wrote a blog detailing every factual error and inconsistancy. Must have used his remote and gone frame by frame in slowmooooooo. I dont think Im that bad, yet. But with a little help from my friends maybe I could get a lift and get there sooner.

    Just my pennies worth for a happy sunday reading.

    Signed
    Rodney the Geek from somewhere in the South of England

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