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Thread: Without systemd

  1. #31
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    Default Re: Without systemd

    On Fri, 23 Oct 2015 17:46:01 +0000, consused wrote:

    >> That was early days, but a lot of that feeling persists today.

    > I remember those days, so Jim please put your whitewash and brush away.


    The problem is that as far as some people are concerned, there's no
    forgiveness possible for LP. None, whatsoever.

    It's time people move past that history.

    Jim
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  2. #32
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    Default Re: Without systemd

    Quote Originally Posted by hendersj View Post
    On Fri, 23 Oct 2015 17:46:01 +0000, consused wrote:

    >> That was early days, but a lot of that feeling persists today.

    > I remember those days, so Jim please put your whitewash and brush away.


    The problem is that as far as some people are concerned, there's no
    forgiveness possible for LP. None, whatsoever.

    It's time people move past that history.
    If there are still some people expressing that old grudge, then it sounds like a form of "bike shedding", certainly in discussions re systemd.

    Once upon a time, PulseAudio caused serious problems for users needing to remove it, such as pro/am musicians using the JACK sound server or users with familiar configs that just didn't require P/A. For most desktop users today it provides a reliable audio experience for a range of multimedia players, and gui-based configuration tools. It can also be removed, or even suspended by adding a simple command in JACK's setup program (qjackctl).

    P/A did replace inadequate or unmaintained sound servers, but it didn't affect system administration generally, nor the operating system's other servers, nor does it contribute to a centralized design approach in the way systemd does.

    I don't recall any particular "mission creep" with P/A, where in the case of systemd LP attempts to sanitize it as "feature creep". Mission creep should always raise questions like "hmm, did I sign up to that, so where is this heading, and how does it impact other projects and the ecosystem in which it is operating?"

    LP wants to unify components across the distros, because he and friends think they know what makes a good operating system. Oh, and there was me (and I hope some others) thinking that the diversity and fairly good-natured competition, between linux distros and between the component projects, both gave rise to many continually improving and easily accessible technologies.
    Leap 42.3 (ext4, KDE Plasma 5.8.7) ~ stable
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  3. #33
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    Default Re: Without systemd

    On Sat, 24 Oct 2015 15:46:01 +0000, consused wrote:

    > hendersj;2733331 Wrote:
    >> On Fri, 23 Oct 2015 17:46:01 +0000, consused wrote:
    >>
    >> >> That was early days, but a lot of that feeling persists today.
    >> > I remember those days, so Jim please put your whitewash and brush

    >> away.
    >>
    >> The problem is that as far as some people are concerned, there's no
    >> forgiveness possible for LP. None, whatsoever.
    >>
    >> It's time people move past that history.

    > If there are still some people expressing that old grudge, then it
    > sounds like a form of "bike shedding", certainly in discussions re
    > systemd.


    Indeed, it is.

    > LP wants to unify components across the distros, because he and friends
    > think they know what makes a good operating system. Oh, and there was me
    > (and I hope some others) thinking that the diversity and fairly
    > good-natured competition between linux distros and the component
    > projects gave rise to continually improving and easily accessible
    > technology.


    There's nothing stopping anyone from creating another init system, or
    continuing to maintain sysvinit.

    The continual pining for sysvinit comes across as "will someone just DO
    this?" - but what it takes for someone to do it is for *someone to do
    it*. As the slogan goes, "just do it".

    Jim

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    openSUSE Forums Administrator
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  4. #34
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    Default Re: Without systemd

    On Sat, 24 Oct 2015 19:36:13 +0000, Jim Henderson wrote:

    > There's nothing stopping anyone from creating another init system, or
    > continuing to maintain sysvinit.


    Indeed, that's where systemd came from - several people who were not
    happy with Upstart deciding to start over.

    Upstart came from a desire to move away from a serial startup system to
    an event-driven system.

    Jim

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    Jim Henderson
    openSUSE Forums Administrator
    Forum Use Terms & Conditions at http://tinyurl.com/openSUSE-T-C

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