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Thread: openSUSE and Novell

  1. #1

    Question openSUSE and Novell

    Hello!

    I've been a long time away from the "RPM Family" and using the "Debian Family" of Linux Distributions. I wish to change that and "re-discover" the first, as when joining the words "Linux" and "Enterprise" (if one day I hope to use Linux at some future job/work and not only at home just because I like it better than any other O.S.) only two company names really come to mind: Red Hat and Novell. And their Linux are RPM-Based.

    When "googleing" for "fedora opensuse" (whitout the quotes), it's clear on many forums and blogs that openSUSE fits better my needs and is even viewed more favorably by most users than Fedora. Among other things, its primary focus on KDE would be good to throw me away from my "GTK+ Comfort Zone" and it's claimed by many to fit well both the roles of a Desktop and a Server environment.

    But when searching "Novell" and "Red Hat", I've found some concerning posts/blog entries about the first "losing ground" on the Enterprise market to the second.

    I don't know if that's true, because all of this was based purely on google search. But it raised me some concerns that I would like to address here at the Forums before formally trying openSUSE for the first time (and maybe in some months help on any way, even if only beta testing future packages because I'm already a bit experienced with Linux):

    - What is the relation between SUSE and openSUSE compared to Red Hat and Fedora? What are the main differences?

    - Is there any data that points to the contrary, that SUSE is actually stable or growing and not losing Enterprise market to Red Hat? (Globally speaking of course and not only considering Europe and/or US)

    - Last but not least, what would happen to openSUSE if Novell one day would just close its doors? Is it's user and developer base large enough to continue the project independently of sponsorship?

    Thanks in advance for any answers. And remember that the points that I've raised here are based solely on google search and not on any "real" data that I could bring or point out.

    Best Regards.

  2. #2

    Default Re: openSUSE and Novell

    On 2014-04-30, icmp request <icmp_request@no-mx.forums.opensuse.org> wrote:
    > - What is the relation between SUSE and openSUSE compared to Fedora and
    > Red Hat? What are the main differences?


    For someone to ask this question, that person would have to have had experience using not only Fedora and RHEL but also
    openSUSE AND SLED/SLES. Consequently, you might have more luck posting this question to the Enterprise forums (i.e.
    Red-Hat and SUSE Enterprise) rather than the community forum here.

    > - Is there any data that points to the contrary, that SUSE is actually
    > stable or growing and not losing market to Red Hat? (Globally speaking
    > of course and not only considering Europe and/or US)


    Do you mean openSUSE? If so, no. Current metrics are very unreliable, but they indicate that openSUSE (always a green
    line!) numbers have stayed flat for many years. If you mean SUSE, you need to ask the SUSE forum. My guess is no but
    don't take my word for it.

    > - Last but not least, what would happen to openSUSE if Novell one day
    > would just close its doors? Is it's user and developer base large enough
    > to continue the project independently of sponsorship?


    Interviews with SUSE staff have always indicated that SUSE needs openSUSE more than the other way round, but perhaps
    they're just being nice . With the SUSE/openSUSE project having lasted nearly two decades, if you're worried about
    it's longevity, then no distro will satisfy you.

    > Thanks in advance for any answers. And remember that the points that
    > I've raised here are based solely on google search and not on any "real"
    > data that I could bring or point out.


    There is a distinct lack of data if you're talking about GNU/Linux distribution market share represented using
    definitive statistics. However I have a few suggestions for you because your post seems to suggest you're trying to
    decide between Fedora and openSUSE:

    1. A decision based on market share of their Enterprise equivalents is probably one of the most arbitrary one you could
    make.
    2. Posting to an openSUSE forum is likely to give you biased answers. Try posting your questions in others (e.g.
    Fedora's) or neutral forums (e.g. linux.com).
    3. It's easy to waste a lot of time trying to decide between distributions, because GNU/Linux is essentially GNU/Linux.
    4. Try both Fedora and openSUSE and decide on keeping one if you prefer it, or keep both as a dual install if you want.
    5. If you decide in the end to change then switching between RPM distros is not usually a big deal.


  3. #3

    Default Re: openSUSE and Novell

    It's not much about deciding between Fedora and OpenSUSE because of their features or usability. It's about both being sponsored by the 2 Linux companies that have the most part of the Enterprise Market and having read some concerning posts about Novell's future. Maybe your post suggesting to ask on SUSE's Forums just show how independent openSUSE is from Novell (and it's a good thing), or maybe it's something to consider doing.

    In either way, thanks for the answers.

  4. #4
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    Default Re: openSUSE and Novell

    On Wed 30 Apr 2014 05:16:02 PM CDT, icmp request wrote:


    It's not much about deciding between Fedora and OpenSUSE because of
    their features or usability. It's about both being sponsored by the 2
    Linux companies that have the most part of the Enterprise Market and
    having read some concerning posts about Novell's future. Maybe your post
    suggesting to ask on SUSE's Forums just show how independent openSUSE is
    from Novell (and it's a good thing), or maybe it's something to consider
    doing.

    In either way, thanks for the answers.


    Hi
    Just to clarify Novell and SUSE are separate entities, but are part of
    The Attachmate Group.

    --
    Cheers Malcolm °¿° SUSE Knowledge Partner (Linux Counter #276890)
    openSUSE 13.1 (Bottle) (x86_64) GNOME 3.10.1 Kernel 3.11.10-7-desktop
    If you find this post helpful and are logged into the web interface,
    please show your appreciation and click on the star below... Thanks!


  5. #5

    Default Re: openSUSE and Novell

    Quote Originally Posted by malcolmlewis View Post
    Hi
    Just to clarify Novell and SUSE are separate entities, but are part of
    The Attachmate Group.

    --
    Cheers Malcolm °¿° SUSE Knowledge Partner (Linux Counter #276890)
    openSUSE 13.1 (Bottle) (x86_64) GNOME 3.10.1 Kernel 3.11.10-7-desktop
    If you find this post helpful and are logged into the web interface,
    please show your appreciation and click on the star below... Thanks!
    Does it mean if one day SUSE Project closes, it will have no significant impact on the future of openSUSE?

    I think that's the main point of the topic, how much impact any changes on SUSE could have on openSUSE.

  6. #6
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    Default Re: openSUSE and Novell

    On 2014-04-30 14:07, flymail wrote:
    > On 2014-04-30, icmp request <> wrote:


    >> - What is the relation between SUSE and openSUSE compared to Fedora and
    >> Red Hat? What are the main differences?

    >
    > For someone to ask this question, that person would have to have had experience using not only Fedora and RHEL but also
    > openSUSE AND SLED/SLES. Consequently, you might have more luck posting this question to the Enterprise forums (i.e.
    > Red-Hat and SUSE Enterprise) rather than the community forum here.


    Rather «for someone to answer this question». Anybody can ask. ;-)



    >> - Last but not least, what would happen to openSUSE if Novell one day
    >> would just close its doors? Is it's user and developer base large enough
    >> to continue the project independently of sponsorship?

    >
    > Interviews with SUSE staff have always indicated that SUSE needs openSUSE more than the other way round, but perhaps
    > they're just being nice . With the SUSE/openSUSE project having lasted nearly two decades, if you're worried about
    > it's longevity, then no distro will satisfy you.


    Both depend on each other. At a minimum, SUSE needs openSUSE as a
    testing ground. You can not dump on the enterprise servers things fresh
    and raw from development. You need lot of testing.

    And, openSUSE needs the servers used to store the build farm, download
    servers, diverse communication channels, and the paid staffers that keep
    all that running, and those that do also software development,
    bug-catching, packaging.... There is a lot done by volunteers, but we
    need staffers and hardware.


    > 1. A decision based on market share of their Enterprise equivalents is probably one of the most arbitrary one you could
    > make.


    I would simply choose the one that's easier to maintain/admin for *me*.

    --
    Cheers / Saludos,

    Carlos E. R.

    (from 13.1 x86_64 "Bottle" (Minas Tirith))

  7. #7
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    Default Re: openSUSE and Novell

    On 2014-04-30 19:16, icmp request wrote:
    >
    > It's not much about deciding between Fedora and OpenSUSE because of
    > their features or usability. It's about both being sponsored by the 2
    > Linux companies that have the most part of the Enterprise Market and
    > having read some concerning posts about Novell's future.


    You could post at least links to those so that we can say something.

    It could be just people that dislike Novell, and talk bad about it. I
    know some of the things they often say, but I'm not going to speculate
    on which you have heard. :-)

    --
    Cheers / Saludos,

    Carlos E. R.

    (from 13.1 x86_64 "Bottle" (Minas Tirith))

  8. #8

    Default Re: openSUSE and Novell

    Quote Originally Posted by robin_listas View Post
    On 2014-04-30 19:16, icmp request wrote:
    >
    > It's not much about deciding between Fedora and OpenSUSE because of
    > their features or usability. It's about both being sponsored by the 2
    > Linux companies that have the most part of the Enterprise Market and
    > having read some concerning posts about Novell's future.


    You could post at least links to those so that we can say something.

    It could be just people that dislike Novell, and talk bad about it. I
    know some of the things they often say, but I'm not going to speculate
    on which you have heard. :-)

    --
    Cheers / Saludos,

    Carlos E. R.

    (from 13.1 x86_64 "Bottle" (Minas Tirith))
    Thanks!

    Actually, I didn't know if it was prudent or not to post the links. But as being asked for them, here they are:

    http://www.cnet.com/news/novell-slap...ating-red-hat/

    http://readwrite.com/2013/01/25/does...oCWZ8L89Ho8gTu

    http://www.businesscloudnews.com/201...e-for-red-hat/

    http://www.internetnews.com/ent-news...ve-threat.html

    http://thelinuxworks.blogspot.com.br...e-why-red.html

    http://techrights.org/2013/10/03/ballnux-demoted/

  9. #9
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    Default Re: openSUSE and Novell

    Quote Originally Posted by icmp_request View Post
    - What is the relation between SUSE and openSUSE compared to Red Hat and Fedora? What are the main differences?
    openSUSE is a foundation on whose board SUSE has seats; SUSE donates a percentage of its annual profits to openSUSE. I cannot comment on the precise relationship between RedHat and Fedora.

    Quote Originally Posted by icmp_request View Post
    - Is there any data that points to the contrary, that SUSE is actually stable or growing and not losing Enterprise market to Red Hat? (Globally speaking of course and not only considering Europe and/or US)
    In the last financial year, SUSE increased sales globally; it had a 23% increase in the US; it is the largest Enterprise Vendor in China - ahead of Red Flag. (That meant its financial support for openSUSE went up.)

    Quote Originally Posted by icmp_request View Post
    - Last but not least, what would happen to openSUSE if Novell one day would just close its doors? Is it's user and developer base large enough to continue the project independently of sponsorship?
    Nothing because Novell has not had anything to do with openSUSE since 2011. Who knows? But, given SUSE's position in the global market and its expressed view that it wants to develop openSUSE to complement SUSE, this does not seem to be a question that openSUSE is going to have to answer in the foreseeable future.

  10. #10

    Default Re: openSUSE and Novell

    On 2014-04-30, Carlos E. R. <robin_listas@no-mx.forums.opensuse.org> wrote:
    > On 2014-04-30 14:07, flymail wrote:
    >> On 2014-04-30, icmp request <> wrote:

    >
    >>> - What is the relation between SUSE and openSUSE compared to Fedora and
    >>> Red Hat? What are the main differences?

    >>
    >> For someone to ask this question, that person would have to have had experience using not only Fedora and RHEL but also
    >> openSUSE AND SLED/SLES. Consequently, you might have more luck posting this question to the Enterprise forums (i.e.
    >> Red-Hat and SUSE Enterprise) rather than the community forum here.

    >
    > Rather «for someone to answer this question». Anybody can ask. ;-)


    Meh! Of course I meant `answer' rather than `ask'!

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