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Thread: no boot when IDE drives plugged

  1. #1

    Default no boot when IDE drives plugged

    Hi all,

    I assembled the PC myself,
    and it did run without any problems under openSUSE 12.1 and 12.3, and win7,
    for about one and a half years - without the IDE drives plugged.

    During that time it had a PCI card plugged - a SCSI adapter ADAPTEC AHA2940U2W -
    which connected a CD-writer attached by the SCSI bus.
    No problem.

    For that PC I once selected the motherboard ASUS P8H67-V (capable of UEFI booting),
    for a reason.

    This motherboard still/or again had an IDE bus,
    which I in fact intended to use for the IDE devices now just plugged:
    Yamaha CRW 3200E, and
    NEC DVD_RW ND-4570A

    Until they were moved to this PC these devices worked very well under openSUSE 12.3
    in an old PentiumIII PC.

    OK, I plug the DVD / CD drives to the IDE connector on the ASUS P8H67-V motherboard.

    No boot at all. Using any live Linux.

    If I disconnect the only CD writer on the SCSI bus, a Yamaha 2100:

    GParted i486 (downloaded 2014-04-24) - boots.

    Windows7 - boots.

    openSUSE 12.2 x86_64 live CD - doesn't boot.

    PartedMagic downloaded 2012-05-14 - doesn't boot.

    But worst:

    openSUSE 13.1 64bit installer DVD doesn't boot.

    Means, I am not able to install openSUSE 13.1 on this PC
    in its current configuration,
    although IDE drives aren't something exotic.

    Thanks for any hints
    Mike

  2. #2

    Default Re: no boot when IDE drives plugged

    More tests:

    ubuntu-14.04-desktop-amd64.iso - doesn't boot.

    I'm not sad about that, since KDE is looking and feeling so much better -
    even with all gimicks like transparency disabled.

    Parted Magic 2013-02-28 (Default settings 32) - boots.

    Parted Magic 2013-02-28 64 (bit) - doesn't boot.

    openSUSE-Factory-NET-x86_64-Build0176-Media.iso (openSUSE 13.2) - doesn't boot.

    openSUSE-Factory-NET-i586-Build0178-Media.iso (openSUSE 13.2) - doesn't boot.

    Currently I'm downloading Ubuntu 14-04 32bit.
    I don't really want to install it,
    neither for the desktop (see above),
    nor since my target PC has 8 GB of RAM.

    But ...

  3. #3
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    Default Re: no boot when IDE drives plugged

    As I recall there are some BIOS setting that may effect booting on IDE based drives. Check and play with any you might find

    You did not say if a BIOS or EFI BIOS machine?. I'm guessing EFI but 1.5 years old it may be either.

  4. #4
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    Default Re: no boot when IDE drives plugged

    Quote Originally Posted by ratzi View Post
    Means, I am not able to install openSUSE 13.1 on this PC
    in its current configuration,
    although IDE drives aren't something exotic.
    I only have two IDE drives in the house.

    One of those is in an external drive enclosure, so it is seen as a USB drive. The other is in an older 32-bit computer.

    That older 32bit computer has only the one IDE drive (no SATA drive). It is running opensuse 13.1, installed with the 32-bit DVD. I don't think there is a specific IDE problem with opensuse. It is more likely a problem with the particular hardware combination, though I don't know what the problem might be.
    openSUSE Leap 15.3; KDE Plasma 5.18.6;

  5. #5

    Default Re: no boot when IDE drives plugged

    Hi gogalthorp !

    Quote Originally Posted by gogalthorp View Post
    As I recall there are some BIOS setting that may effect booting on IDE based drives. Check and play with any you might find

    You did not say if a BIOS or EFI BIOS machine?. I'm guessing EFI but 1.5 years old it may be either.
    It's an EFI BIOS, able of UEFI booting.
    But still I don't intend to UEFI boot and still prefer legacy GRUB.
    That's more simple than GRUB2, and my hard disk only has 2 TB.

    Yes, I looked into the BIOS settings, but didn't find anything about the IDE bus / drives.

    I do not need to boot from those IDE drives -
    these are a CD writer, and a DVD writer.

    I currently boot all those live Linuxes that I tried from a SATA DVD-ROM device.

    Once I tried to boot from the NEC DVD writer, attached by IDE - the behaviour
    and the results are pretty much the same.
    The device itself works fine, and the results seem to be the same.

    Windows7 boots from the internal hard disk,
    that was just cloned from the old hard disk that failed.
    I cloned using dd.

    All I want is that the system boots and doesn't hang.

    I doubt that 13.1 would work when installed on that hard disk,
    if the live system that runs from an USB stick hangs.

    Still I would like to use the two drives, especially the Yamaha.
    It is the very only drive I ever had that reliably could burn audio CD's
    that I could use in my car.

    I think it's amazing, that some more recent Linux systems boot,
    like the GParted (i486),
    and the newer Parted Magic - but that one only for 32bit !

    Wait, I'll just try something:
    boot from the newer Parted Magic CD
    put into the NEC drive that is attached by IDE.

    It is reading:

    Loading /pmagic/bzImage... ok
    Loading /pmagic/initrd.img...

    Then a hundred messages or more.
    Then:

    'Setting up system devices...'

    and then the system hangs.

    Another try with the same CD in the SATA DVD-ROM drive.

    No, that's not true, same result.

    Power off again.
    Power on with CD in SATA DVD-ROM drive.

    Menu comes up.
    Select 32 (32bit probably).

    Now the system hangs at a different point:
    last messages:

    Code:
    [  3.369949] scsi 4:0:0:0: CD-ROM _NEC DVD_RW ND-4570A 1.02 PQ: 0 ANSI: 5
    [  3.371671] sr1: scsi3-mmc drive: 48x/48x writer dvd-ram cd/rw xa/form2 cddatray
    [  3.371936] sr 4:0:0:0: Attached scsi CD-ROM sr1
    
    [  3.372157] ACPI: Invalid Power Resource to register!
    [  3.373089] scsi 4:0:1:0: CD-ROM YAMAHA CRW3200E 1.0d PQ: 0 ANSI: 2
    I typed this by hand.

    Maybe I need to check my cables.

    Thanks for your reply
    Mike

  6. #6

    Default Re: no boot when IDE drives plugged

    Hi nrickert !

    Quote Originally Posted by nrickert View Post
    The other is in an older 32-bit computer.

    That older 32bit computer has only the one IDE drive (no SATA drive). It is running opensuse 13.1, installed with the 32-bit DVD.
    That seems to resemble the old PC that I just dismissed.

    The two IDE drives were plugged in that old pentium III PC and worked fine.

    Yes, I had openSUSE 12.3 (32 bit) running on that old PC.

    I was lucky with that, and as well disk burning worked fine on that old system.

    Quote Originally Posted by nrickert View Post
    I don't think there is a specific IDE problem with opensuse.
    OK.

    Quote Originally Posted by nrickert View Post
    It is more likely a problem with the particular hardware combination, though I don't know what the problem might be.
    Maybe the cable(s), see previous post.

    I'll check and report back.

    Thanks for your reply
    Mike

  7. #7

    Default Re: no boot when IDE drives plugged

    Hi all,

    I replaced the IDE cable by a new IDE cable, literally,
    it is the IDE cable that came with the motherboard,
    that still was in its original packing.
    Power supply is good.

    I even removed the ADAPTEC SCSI controler from the PC.

    Despite all this, things didn't really improve.

    I could boot Parted Magic with failsafe settings, which seem to be:
    acpi=off vga=normal nopcmcia noscsi nogpm nosmart no-iscsi nolapic.

    I could boot GParted with ide=nodma (and quiet and nosplash options removed).

    Normal booting wasn't possible with the IDE drives plugged.

    I unplugged the IDE drives for now.

    I need the PC and will try again later.

    I will check in a few days if an update of the BIOS helps.

    Thanks for your comments!
    Mike

  8. #8
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    Default Re: no boot when IDE drives plugged

    IDE drives can change the boot sequence. Maybe check that. I've never heard of this problem before so just guessing.

  9. #9
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    Default Re: no boot when IDE drives plugged

    Quote Originally Posted by ratzi View Post
    I replaced the IDE cable by a new IDE cable, literally,
    it is the IDE cable that came with the motherboard,
    that still was in its original packing.
    Power supply is good.
    It occurs to me, that it is typical for IDE drives to need setting jumpers.

    An IDE interface usually has a primary channel and a secondary channel. The jumpers select which. If both IDE drives are using the same interface, then you have to make sure that one is set to primary and the other to secondary. Otherwise you will have conflicts.

    There is usually some fine print on the physical drive indicating the appropriate jumper settings. And there is often a spare jumper inserted where it does nothing, that you can take out and put into the appropriate place.
    openSUSE Leap 15.3; KDE Plasma 5.18.6;

  10. #10

    Default Re: no boot when IDE drives plugged

    Hi gogalthorp!

    Quote Originally Posted by gogalthorp View Post
    IDE drives can change the boot sequence. Maybe check that. I've never heard of this problem before so just guessing.
    Yes, drives can change the boot sequence.
    But these IDE drives are no hard disks.
    And they didn't have any discs inserted (CDs or DVDs),
    so Linux just couldn't find any drive there,
    and couldn't mount anything.

    Yes, the problem is a bit strange.
    Maybe the BIOS.

    Thanks for your comment!
    Mike

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