Looking for advice on installing on UEFI desktop

English Install/Boot/Login
1

I purchased a new desktop PC , as documented in this thread: https://forums.opensuse.org/showthread.php/493659-Hardware-motherboard-experience-for-new-PC?highlight=hardware

I’m looking for opinions on how to install an OS on this PC if UEFI/GPT is selected ?

The PC comes with a 2 TB hard drive, and a 256 GB SSD drive, and without an operating system installed (at my request). The motherboard is a Gigabyte Z87X-D3H which supports UEFI.

I’m thinking of puting on the 256GB SSD drive the following;

The 2 TB HD drive I plan to carve up into a couple of partitions to hold the /home (ie the data) for the openSUSE installs. I could also put partitions such as /var and /tmp on the 2 TB HD as part of an effort to reduce wear and tear on the SSD drive.

My research into Windows7 failed to give me one case of where a PC with only GNU/Linux only in a UEFI/GPT setup (but with empty drive space/partition) had windows7 installed later. Every guide I found had Windows7 installed BEFORE openSUSE. I don’t have Windows7 currently, and it may take a week or two to obtain in an inexpensive OEM version to install. Hence I would prefer to install it later, but this appears frought with risk/uncertainty (and hence Windows7 must be installed first). Opinions?

Free Dos - has anyone actually succeeded in putting freedos on a UEFI/GPT system ?

My SSD drive, although it has no partitions, is flagged as MBR. I’m I correct this is a simple matter to reflag it as GPT ?

Here is some detail on the hardware (obtained by booting to a liveDVD) :

and from fdisk -l


linux:/home/linux # fdisk -l

Disk /dev/sdb: 256.1 GB, 256060514304 bytes, 500118192 sectors
Units = sectors of 1 * 512 = 512 bytes
Sector size (logical/physical): 512 bytes / 512 bytes
I/O size (minimum/optimal): 512 bytes / 512 bytes
Disk label type: dos
Disk identifier: 0xa0f97c4b

   Device Boot      Start         End      Blocks   Id  System

Disk /dev/sda: 2000.4 GB, 2000398934016 bytes, 3907029168 sectors
Units = sectors of 1 * 512 = 512 bytes
Sector size (logical/physical): 512 bytes / 4096 bytes
I/O size (minimum/optimal): 4096 bytes / 4096 bytes

I was curious if these were setup for gpt, so I tried gdisk:

First the hard drive:


linux:/home/linux # gdisk -l /dev/sda
GPT fdisk (gdisk) version 0.8.7

Partition table scan:
  MBR: not present
  BSD: not present
  APM: not present
  GPT: not present

Creating new GPT entries.
Disk /dev/sda: 3907029168 sectors, 1.8 TiB
Logical sector size: 512 bytes
Disk identifier (GUID): 1E15EA18-90C0-419B-B2F6-DDF9EF154E9C
Partition table holds up to 128 entries
First usable sector is 34, last usable sector is 3907029134
Partitions will be aligned on 2048-sector boundaries
Total free space is 3907029101 sectors (1.8 TiB)

Number  Start (sector)    End (sector)  Size       Code  Name

and then the SSD drive:


linux:/home/linux # gdisk -l /dev/sdb
GPT fdisk (gdisk) version 0.8.7

Partition table scan:
  MBR: MBR only
  BSD: not present
  APM: not present
  GPT: not present


***************************************************************
Found invalid GPT and valid MBR; converting MBR to GPT format
in memory. 
***************************************************************

Disk /dev/sdb: 500118192 sectors, 238.5 GiB
Logical sector size: 512 bytes
Disk identifier (GUID): D709EEE3-CA60-49FA-8AC1-ABA4427C27DF
Partition table holds up to 128 entries
First usable sector is 34, last usable sector is 500118158
Partitions will be aligned on 2048-sector boundaries
Total free space is 500118125 sectors (238.5 GiB)

Number  Start (sector)    End (sector)  Size       Code  Name
2

I booted the PC to a gparted liveCD and it appears it will be easy to change the SSD to a GPT … I note this:

http://thumbnails111.imagebam.com/30166/e64a0c301659202.jpg](http://www.imagebam.com/image/e64a0c301659202)
[click on the image above for a larger image view]

and for the interested, this is what I see on the 2 TB hard drive:
http://thumbnails101.imagebam.com/30166/4d4143301659199.jpg](http://www.imagebam.com/image/4d4143301659199)
*[click on the image above for a larger image view]
*

So I think I now need to decide if I carve up the HD/SSD the way I want and then install openSUSE now, or if I wait until I have Windows7, install that, and only then install openSUSE. … :\ < thinking > … I still have not decided if I want to put Windows7 on this PC. For certain openSUSE is going on the PC.

3

How about if you were to install openSUSE now.

Then, if and when you decide to put W7 on it, you back up all your system first.

After W7 is on, if you can’t get things to work properly in short order, follow up with another – but basic – install of openSUSE, then restore your root and home partitions from the backup of your working system?

::\ <thinking too>

-fb

4

Hi oldcpu !

Sorry, I missed your previous thread.

Just only checked the first few lines of your posting,
and … me personally, I do see a problem with windows 7
(not with openSUSE).

Not too long ago I assembled a PC my own,
using a motherboard capable of UEFI booting.

I just couldn’t get windows 7 install on a GPT partition.

And when - at least - I finally got windows 7 installing in UEFI mode,
by the help of please_try_again,
windows 7 created some weird kind of partition table.

The thread is
http://forums.opensuse.org/showthread.php/475347-error-occurred-while-installing-grub-during-os-11-4-installation-error-25-asus-efi-bios#post2463057
don’t put it aside just because oS11.4 appears in the title - I finally installed oS (openSUSE) 12.1.

Since your hard disk has only 2TB size (like my hard disk),
you probably could as well still format it using an MBR partition table.
For example:

(1) primary partition - microsoft reserved - created by win 7, which probably should be installed first
(2) win 7 (NTFS) “drive” C:
(3) freedos
(4) extended partition for

  • openSUSE partitions (swap, perhaps two / or root as logical “drives” in the first part of this extended partition, and two /home after that)
  • a possible NTFS “drive” D: for windows and data exchange.

However, if your hard disk has physical sectors/blocks of size 4096 instead of 512 bytes then you may have a problem.

Otherwise not.
Booting openSUSE, you should further still be able to use additional hard disks with more than 2 TB size that have a GPT - at least as far as I read.

Good luck !
Mike

5

This should read:

I just couldn’t get windows 7 installed on a drive with a GPT partition table.

6

Further thoughts

Where is the need to do this ?
Leave it as it is, i.e. use MBR for it.

Yes, you are at a different starting point than I was, because you have two drives - the SSD and the hard disk
(I only had and still have one hard disk).
I didn’t take that into account in my posting above.

If you don’t want to use the SSD as a cache, but as a separate drive,
then you probaly would like to boot openSUSE from the SSD,
to speed up booting.

freedos would probably like to boot from that SSD in non-UEFI mode as well
(i.e. booting from a hard disk/SSD with MBR).

And windows 7 doesn’t even seem to have the capability to secure-boot
(which would require UEFI-booting).

You may end up with an MBR for your SSD and a GPT for your hard disk.

But I have no idea if windows 7 will support this,
if any “drive” like D: is to be placed on the hard disk when this one has a GPT.

Good luck !
Mike

7

Yes, that is in fact why I limited myself to a 2 TB hard drive. I wanted a backup option of adopting an MBR approach. I know how to easily install GNU/Linux on an MBR system, and then later install MS-Windows-7.

But I would like to learn about UEFI/GPT, and one way to do it, is to put same on one’s PC. Hence my being tempted to go for the challenge of a UEFI/MBR approach.

8

I thought about this but when I surfed to try and find proof that one could mix MBR and GPT with one operating system, I had no success in obtaining successful examples (only posts of users with trouble and no solutions).

9

Understand. I recall that thread of yours.

Having typed that, I also note there are videos on youtube showing cases of users who succeeded , and they give step by step guidance in the video. But in all cases, they started with a clean unpartitioned hard drive.

10

I am very tempted to do that.

11

On Thu 16 Jan 2014 08:16:02 PM CST, oldcpu wrote:

I purchased a new desktop PC , as documented in this thread:
http://tinyurl.com/m6uswtp

I’M LOOKING FOR OPINIONS ON HOW TO INSTALL AN OS ON THIS PC IF UEFI/GPT
IS SELECTED ?
The PC comes with a 2 TB hard drive, and a 256 GB SSD drive, and without
an operating system installed (at my request). The motherboard is a
Gigabyte Z87X-D3H which supports UEFI.

I’m thinking of puting on the 256GB SSD drive the following;

  • freedos - which may be possible per :
    Re: "freedos" Command HowTo?
  • windows7 - it appears this may need to go on first , albeit I would
    prefer to install it later
  • openSUSE-13.1 ( / root partition)
  • openSUSE-TBD (some TBD milestone/beta release)
  • swap

Hi
Why free-dos, you do realize that BIOS updates can be done via efi
and/or a usb device? Well that’s how HP’s do the update, or re-install
if it bricks (one nice feature of HP’s)

Install Windows onto the rotating drive, as in disconnect the ssd, then
just use dd to copy the efi partition onto the ssd after it’s
reconnected, then install openSUSE on the ssd and don’t format the efi
partition, but set to /boot/efi as the mount point.

This is the method I used for windows 8/8.1.

Not worth putting any /tmp or /var/tmp on the rotating drive (it will
slow down the boot as systemd has to mount these), just adjust the io
schedule. You will need to do this as your mixing ssd and rotating
drives. Set the swapiness and you should be good to go.

I just use the ssd here, this is a dual core machine 1.9GHz, nothing
fancy and from power on to desktop is between 8 to 10.5 seconds;


systemd-analyze
Startup finished in 3.576s (firmware) + 27ms (loader) + 2.832s (kernel) + 2.180s (userspace) = 8.617s

I use gummiboot, no plymouth and no delay, just power on and go…

–
Cheers Malcolm °¿° SUSE Knowledge Partner (Linux Counter #276890)
openSUSE 13.1 (Bottle) (x86_64) GNOME 3.10.2 Kernel 3.11.6-4-desktop
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12

Hi oldcpu.

You might be interested reading this link.
The key words are " protected MBR in a GPT"
http://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/library/windows/hardware/gg463525.aspx

Might give you some interesting hint to make the two world work.

Edit:
i am waiting for my SSD and HD this week and I will be following this thread
for my installation as one of my references.:slight_smile:

13

On Thu 16 Jan 2014 09:26:01 PM CST, ratzi wrote:

ratzi;2616666 Wrote:
> I just couldn’t get windows 7 install on a GPT partition.

This should read:

I just couldn’t get windows 7 installed on a drive with a GPT partition
table.

Hi
I do it all the time with laptops, no issues at all, you need to make
sure it’s 64bit (a 32bit license is valid for 64bit as well). Did you
create the additional ms partition?
sda1 - 260MB type ef00
sda2 - 128MB type 0c01
mkfs.vfat -F 16 /dev/sda1


Else let the windows install dvd do it's thing (I use an oem one).

--
Cheers Malcolm °¿° SUSE Knowledge Partner (Linux Counter #276890)
openSUSE 13.1 (Bottle) (x86_64) GNOME 3.10.2 Kernel 3.11.6-4-desktop
If you find this post helpful and are logged into the web interface,
please show your appreciation and click on the star below... Thanks!
14

Thanks. Its an interesting read.

15

If I read that quote correctly, I could create those partitions in advance of any install (with gparted), initially carving up the disks the way I want prior to installing any OS ? Then follow your previous suggestion wrt disconnecting/installing/connecting/copying drives and EFI content when installing Win7.

16

I’m thinking Win7 needs the reverse. ie GPT for SSD (boot) and MBR for HD (data) could work. Reference: Windows and GPT FAQ - Windows 10 hardware dev | Microsoft Learn and I quote from it:

Having typed the above, if I can succeed I would prefer to have both SSD and HD as GPT.

17

Hi again,

The point is, to which windows (7 or 8) the writer is referring.

Citation: “Systems that support UEFI require that boot partition must reside on a GPT disk.”

Is this about windows 8?

This just isn’t true for windows 7, which is the version that you would like to install.

Windows 7, on my PC, boots just fine from the only hard disk that I have, which has an MBR now
(after several installations of openSUSE and win 7 in UEFI mode).

Yours
Mike

18

Dear Malcolm,

I have a 64bit windows 7.

I didn’t create it myself, I ran the windows 7 installer from the windows DVD, and that one created that partition.

But that was on my hard disk when it had an MBR.

If I first installed openSUSE 12.1 in UEFI mode, which created a GPT on the hard disk,
windows 7 thereafter just refused to install on that disk.

Yours
Mike

19

On Thu 16 Jan 2014 10:16:02 PM CST, oldcpu wrote:

malcolmlewis;2616692 Wrote:
> Did you
> create the additional ms partition?
> >
Code:

> >
> sda1 - 260MB type ef00
> sda2 - 128MB type 0c01
> mkfs.vfat -F 16 /dev/sda1
>

> >
> Else let the windows install dvd do it’s thing (I use an oem one).
>

If I read that quote correctly, I could create those partitions in
advance of any install (with gparted), initially carving up the disks
the way I want prior to installing any OS ? Then follow your previous
suggestion wrt disconnecting/installing/connecting/copying drives and
EFI content when installing Win7.

Hi
Yes, windows will respect them, else just boot from the windows dvd in
UEFI mode (You need to ensure the drive is gpt ready though) and it
will create etc, the can move sda1, not sure about sda2 to the ssd from
the rotating drive.

If you want to see how it goes in UEFI/Secure boot, then grab the
openSUSE Rescue CD, a toolkit must these days, image it to a USB device
and if you install additional apps etc, they remain persistent over
reboots.

Does Windows 7 work with secure boot?

–
Cheers Malcolm °¿° SUSE Knowledge Partner (Linux Counter #276890)
openSUSE 13.1 (Bottle) (x86_64) GNOME 3.10.2 Kernel 3.11.6-4-desktop
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please show your appreciation and click on the star below… Thanks!

20

On Thu 16 Jan 2014 11:06:01 PM CST, ratzi wrote:

Dear Malcolm,

malcolmlewis;2616692 Wrote:
> Hi
> I do it all the time with laptops, no issues at all, you need to make
> sure it’s 64bit (a 32bit license is valid for 64bit as well).

I have a 64bit windows 7.

malcolmlewis;2616692 Wrote:
> Did you create the additional ms partition?

I didn’t create it myself, I ran the windows 7 installer from the
windows DVD, and that one created that partition.

But that was on my hard disk when it had an MBR.

If I first installed openSUSE 12.1 in UEFI mode, which created a GPT on
the hard disk,
windows 7 thereafter just refused to install on that disk.

Yours
Mike

Hi
You always need to install windows on it’s own disk gpt disk first, the
nature of the operating system… if you have a fast enough machine,
you can always virtualize it…?

–
Cheers Malcolm °¿° SUSE Knowledge Partner (Linux Counter #276890)
openSUSE 13.1 (Bottle) (x86_64) GNOME 3.10.2 Kernel 3.11.6-4-desktop
If you find this post helpful and are logged into the web interface,
please show your appreciation and click on the star below… Thanks!