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Thread: Two major problems with dual boot installation of openSuSE 11.1 and Windows 7

  1. #31
    Carlos E. R. NNTP User

    Default Re: Two major problems with dual boot installation of openSuSE 11.1and Windows 7

    On 2010-09-28 07:36, please try again wrote:
    >
    > Carlos E. R.;2229336 Wrote:
    >>
    >> The reasoning is that the MBR generic code can only boot a primary
    >> partition marked bootable, and sda6 is a logical. Marking it as bootable
    >> will not work, as far as I know.

    >
    > He! he! I'm glad to read that. But try to tell it to the YaST
    > developpers, as they haven't understood (or accepted) this concept and
    > still instist of activate the root partition without caring whether it
    > is a primary or a logical one.


    But that causes no damage :-)

    > I should add that YaST (by default, of
    > course!) writes a generic bootcode to the MBR without checking (or
    > double checking) if there is one (an only one) bootflag set on a primary
    > (or the extended ) partition ... which ends up - in some cases - in an
    > absolute no-boot situation.


    Correct, they do that sometimes, but it trivial to correct - if you know where to look, of course.

    I wish they'd keep the booting part of the rescue module of the install dvd. Booting problems is
    where most beginners get stuck, I think.

    --
    Cheers / Saludos,

    Carlos E. R.
    (from 11.2 x86_64 "Emerald" at Telcontar)

  2. #32
    Join Date
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    Smile Re: Two major problems with dual boot installation of openSuSE 11.1and Windows 7

    MBR
    P1
    P2
    P2 * + Grub --> boots any partition you like. Like number 29.
    P3


    > This
    > last setup is better when using Windows on the same partition. By just
    > changing the active partition, you can get Windows running directly if
    > need be and no need to play with the MBR when it is generic.


    Yep.

    --
    Cheers / Saludos,
    What ever you are booting must be loaded in one of the four primary partitions and by that we mean GRUB, not openSUSE's location. Since I normally place grub in the openSUSE partition, they would be one and the same, but not so in your example.

    Thank You,
    My Blog: https://forums.opensuse.org/blogs/jdmcdaniel3/

    Software efficiency halves every 18 months, thus compensating for Moore's Law

    Its James again from Austin, Texas

  3. #33

    Post Re: Two major problems with dual boot installation of openSuSE 11.1 and Windows 7

    I had the same problem because of some extra partitions. I found the Windows one that booted correctly and deleted the other ones from the start-up menu window. The partitions are still there (I need them) but they don't show up when I boot the computer.

  4. #34
    Carlos E. R. NNTP User

    Default Re: Two major problems with dual boot installation of openSuSE 11.1and Windows 7

    On 2010-09-29 23:36, jdmcdaniel3 wrote:
    >
    >> MBR
    >> P1
    >> P2
    >> P2 * + Grub --> boots any partition you like. Like number 29.
    >> P3



    > What ever you are booting must be loaded in one of the four primary
    > partitions and by that we mean GRUB, not openSUSE's location. Since I
    > normally place grub in the openSUSE partition, they would be one and the
    > same, but not so in your example.



    I'll explain again how I have it, in my laptop, maybe I haven't been clear enough :-)


    MBR is generic, manufacturer/installer/windows default (it has the string "RecoveryMgr" on it).

    Partition 1, 2, and 3 are windows primaries (NTFS string in sector 0)

    Partition 4 is extended, marked bootable, and has grub in it (and the GRUB word in its sector 0)

    Partition 6 is /boot (separate, ext2). Root is in number 7.


    I know what I'm saying, I'm not confused, and I have it running. I'm looking at it right now, by my
    elbow :-)

    Confirmed by use of fdisk -l, dd, file, and hexdump ;-)


    Ah! And yast did that setup - with some "clever" coaching from me :-) - but it did surprise me that
    it worked. I didn't believe that an extended partition (a container) could be marked bootable, have
    grub in it, and really work, till I did it.


    /etc/grub.conf contains:

    setup --stage2=/boot/grub/stage2 --force-lba (hd0,3) (hd0,5)
    quit

    --
    Cheers / Saludos,

    Carlos E. R.
    (from 11.2 x86_64 "Emerald" at Telcontar)

  5. #35
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    Smile Re: Two major problems with dual boot installation of openSuSE 11.1and Windows 7

    Carlos, I understand what you are saying. You are booting from and have loaded Grub into, the Logical Primary Partition. That is not the same as being loaded into a Logical drive partition as you can only mark partitions 1,2,3 or 4 as bootable. Now I would not have thought about doing this and I have not seen openSUSE suggest such a setup. It is good to know and I will give it a try if I get pushed out of primary partitions due to laptop restore partitions and Windows 7 wanting two partitions, all at the same time. My normal solution though is to just boot from a second hard drive and to leave the first one alone.

    Thank You,
    My Blog: https://forums.opensuse.org/blogs/jdmcdaniel3/

    Software efficiency halves every 18 months, thus compensating for Moore's Law

    Its James again from Austin, Texas

  6. #36
    Carlos E. R. NNTP User

    Default Re: Two major problems with dual boot installation of openSuSE 11.1and Windows 7

    On 2010-09-30 02:06, jdmcdaniel3 wrote:
    >
    > Carlos, I understand what you are saying. You are booting from and have
    > loaded Grub into, the Logical Primary Partition. That is not the same
    > as being loaded into a Logical drive partition as you can only mark
    > partitions 1,2,3 or 4 as bootable.


    We are using different nomenclature, which is confusing, but yes, that is.

    > Now I would not have thought about
    > doing this and I have not seen openSUSE suggest such a setup.


    I don't remember what it suggested, but I modified it a bit.

    > It is
    > good to know and I will give it a try if I get pushed out of primary
    > partitions due to laptop restore partitions and Windows 7 wanting two
    > partitions, all at the same time.


    Win 7 had 3 primaries. And I have heard of some laptops coming installed with all four primaries used.

    > My normal solution though is to just
    > boot from a second hard drive and to leave the first one alone.


    Not an option on a laptop...

    --
    Cheers / Saludos,

    Carlos E. R.
    (from 11.2 x86_64 "Emerald" at Telcontar)

  7. #37
    Join Date
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    Smile Re: Two major problems with dual boot installation of openSuSE 11.1and Windows 7

    > My normal solution though is to just
    > boot from a second hard drive and to leave the first one alone.


    Not an option on a laptop...
    Opps, but it is a possibility. I do it every day. Of course, you must have a second external hard drive, but it can be done. Check out my description on the followng thread.

    How to create a USB boot drive (like the old boot floppies)?

    Now I actively seek and accept all criticism, but the procedure works like a champ. If I am using the wrong terminology for something, like when talking about logical partitions or the drives within, I DO want to know the correct terminology. So please step in with a correction when required.

    Thank You,
    My Blog: https://forums.opensuse.org/blogs/jdmcdaniel3/

    Software efficiency halves every 18 months, thus compensating for Moore's Law

    Its James again from Austin, Texas

  8. #38

    Default Re: Two major problems with dual boot installation of openSuSE 11.1and Windows 7

    Quote Originally Posted by jdmcdaniel3 View Post
    That is not the same as being loaded into a Logical drive partition as you can only mark partitions 1,2,3 or 4 as bootable.
    Well, precisely you can mark any partition bootable (try that in fdisk!) And the partition (even a logical one) will have the bootflag set. You can check with fdisk -l. It's just that it doesn't make sense. I don't know why openSUSE and Fedora's setup do that. Like Carlos said (in some other post), it doesn't damage anything but it just doesn't sound right. If something is not needed, it cannot be useful. And if something is not read it doesn't have to be written. I keep thinking it's a stupid idea until I get the explanation (if there is any).

  9. #39
    Carlos E. R. NNTP User

    Default Re: Two major problems with dual boot installation of openSuSE 11.1and Windows 7

    On 2010-09-30 04:36, jdmcdaniel3 wrote:
    >
    >>> My normal solution though is to just
    >>> boot from a second hard drive and to leave the first one alone.

    >>
    >> Not an option on a laptop...


    > Opps, but it is a possibility. I do it every day. Of course, you must
    > have a second external hard drive, but it can be done. Check out my
    > description on the followng thread.


    External drive? No, thanks... it breaks my definition of "laptop", it will not fit on my lap :-p

    > 'How to create a USB boot drive (like the old boot floppies)?'
    > (http://tinyurl.com/23cmxag)


    I'll have a look.

    > Now I actively seek and accept all criticism, but the procedure works
    > like a champ. If I am using the wrong terminology for something, like
    > when talking about logical partitions or the drives within, I DO want to
    > know the correct terminology. So please step in with a correction when
    > required.


    :-)

    In linux parlance:

    * There are 4 primaries in any HD (used or not).
    * One of these 4 primaries can be of type "extended", which means it is a container partition.
    * The "extended" partition can contain an unlimited number of logical partitions.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Disk_pa...artition_types
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Extended_boot_record

    --
    Cheers / Saludos,

    Carlos E. R.
    (from 11.2 x86_64 "Emerald" at Telcontar)

  10. #40
    Carlos E. R. NNTP User

    Default Re: Two major problems with dual boot installation of openSuSE 11.1and Windows 7

    On 2010-09-30 20:06, please try again wrote:

    > jdmcdaniel3;2230639 Wrote:
    >> That is not the same as being loaded into a Logical drive partition as
    >> you can only mark partitions 1,2,3 or 4 as bootable.
    >>

    >
    > Well, precisely you can mark any partition bootable (try that in
    > fdisk!) And the partition (even a logical one) will have the bootflag
    > set. You can check with fdisk -l. It's just that it doesn't make sense.
    > I don't know why openSUSE and Fedora's setup do that. Like Carlos said
    > (in some other post), it doesn't damage anything but it just doesn't
    > sound right. If something is not needed, it cannot be useful. And if
    > something is not read it doesn't have to be written. I keep thinking
    > it's a stupid idea until I get the explanation (if there is any).


    It could work, with a special boot loader that I don't know if it exists.

    It would be something similar to grub in the MBR. The first sector, the MBR, 512 bytes, is the
    loader. It loads a second stage, stored in the reserved space behind that first sector, same as grub
    does with stage 1.5 and 2. But instead, this code looks what partition, primary or logical, is
    marked bootable, and boots it.

    --
    Cheers / Saludos,

    Carlos E. R.
    (from 11.2 x86_64 "Emerald" at Telcontar)

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